Faction Territories

[smv1172]

Do the faction territories change as a result of working for/against particular groups? It seems a lot of the npc dialog implies their area may be threatened by one of the outside groups or that it'd be nice to wipe out another faction, but is any of that actually going on at the moment?

If not, I'd love that capability, it'd just be interesting to do different playthroughs where you try to help different factions take over the city. Critical contacts could be preserved just switch alliances while others (who's sole purpose is to function with rival faction like connectors/rep reward contacts/etc) may need to be assassinated or captured to allow that territory to get wiped out. Sorry not meant as idea thread, mostly question, but I'm rambly tonight.

[james123]

That's not a bad idea, but I think that would require cory to rename the entire game....

cybersoldier maybe

[sgtcookie]

I don't think that CK can do that. I don't have much info on the way CK works but I don't think that The Storyteller (CK's engine) or the way CK's save file works allows for that.

[blackgauntlet]

It works like ST, actually. No matter how many ships you blow up, credits you spent, missions you completed and/or asses you kissed, the f-ing planet would still belong to its original ruler.

[Cory Trese]

CK does allow region map and ownership changes, to an extent that the game remains in balance.

One common critical comment about ST is that ownership / operation of a particular planet or urban zone cannot be * permanently modified* (in ST ... try buying a good ship somewhere after the planet has been blockaded for a year!)

So, in response to the criticism we added facilities to CK and StoryTeller that allow the changes to ownership.

We have also added that ability to upcoming Star Trader derivatives.

It is just hard to undo choices made at the very beginning. The cost is exponentially higher and those rules were cast in steel before the game was ever for sale.

[blackgauntlet]

@cory- Really? Hell, you should've came clean about this in the first place! But ah... your statement about "remains in balance" is a bit unsettling though... does it mean that a faction would win one territory only to lose another? Regardless of how enterprising, devious and deadly the CyberKnight who was hired to assist them?

[Cory Trese]

No, I mean so that the game remains in balance and continues to make sense.

The story is about a cyber knight who fights in the shadows between corporations and savage street gangs.

I'm sorry you find it unsettling but we have to balance many factors -- design, commercial, support, coding, content, testing and other.

[blackgauntlet]

@cory- Nah, it's cool when you explain it that way. It's just that, if we were able to usurp territories and defend them well enough, sooner or later, we might actually "win" the game as compared to ST where we just keep trying to stay alive longer than our old incarnations and/or predecessor.

[Cory Trese]

I never like to "win" when I play games.

CK will include stories that have endings. Some of them may even be considered victories. The Knight will never "conquer" New Boston or destroy all the corporations.

The whole point of the entire design of ST is that it is open ended. It wouldn't be where it is today in terms of market position if it had an ending.

Chances are the "ending" I established would have been wrong and alienated far more players than the current design even did.

The designs are just different, between CK and ST, for many reasons. But they're still by the same designer

[LordofSyn]

Oct 4, 2011 11:22:14 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

I never like to "win" when I play games.

CK will include stories that have endings. Some of them may even be considered victories. The Knight will never "conquer" New Boston or destroy all the corporations.

The whole point of the entire design of ST is that it is open ended. It wouldn't be where it is today in terms of market position if it had an ending.

Chances are the "ending" I established would have been wrong and alienated far more players than the current design even did.

The designs are just different, between CK and ST, for many reasons. But they're still by the same designer

@cory. I am so excited to see where it goes...but I would also like to help with "story" / flavor text / etc.

call it my Itch to create. I see so many different aspects that I can help. Money isn't my motivation. Creating is my motivation. That I would have others engrossed in my story...that others would have that suspension of disbelief... all of those and more are what every writer; every GM loves and enjoys.

My pen and paper game may be DOA, or may never have the level of "success" that I would like for a number of reasons:
1> pen and paper gaming isn't nearly as popular as it used to be.
2> I am only one guy with a family, so I haven't been able to put as much effort as I would like
3> because (Legion) ISN'T electronic, it will never be as popular as a video game rpg
there are more reasons...but regardless, I know I can bring tons of experience, stories, and thousands of different ideas.

bottom line that I have learned from some of the most prevalent celebrities. If you do not change and roll with the times, you will be run over. I know the immediate future belongs to the micro economy that is the App economy. whether it is the Apple store / Android Market / facebook apps, etc. the future lies there. If I had the $$, time, and some team members then I could have translated Legion to a video game market too.

But it would be wrong. it wouldn't be Legion. Here is why: your imagination has no budget. Pen and paper RPGs will never truly be gone, just as kids will never tire of playing "cops n robbers" or any other imaginary games. Books will always be better than the movie, because your brain doesn't have a special effects budget to worry about.

Legion is and always will be different from CK or ST. That's fine.
...Cyberpunk has been in my head, in my my heart for well over 25 years. I love it. it is still my preferred genre to write in. Even as our days get closer and closer to the realities we have all played or read about in other cyberpunk media, I don't feel it is dead. I feel cyberpunk is about ready for a second renaissance.

No matter what... I am on this team! For better or worse, I still love it, and will continue to do what I do...

so who's with me??

(wow, turned into more of a rant than I wanted)

@cory. I am so excited to see where it goes...but I would also like to help with "story" / flavor text / etc.

call it my Itch to create. I see so many different aspects that I can help. Money isn't my motivation. Creating is my motivation. That I would have others engrossed in my story...that others would have that suspension of disbelief... all of those and more are what every writer; every GM loves and enjoys.

My pen and paper game may be DOA, or may never have the level of "success" that I would like for a number of reasons:
1> pen and paper gaming isn't nearly as popular as it used to be.
2> I am only one guy with a family, so I haven't been able to put as much effort as I would like
3> because (Legion) ISN'T electronic, it will never be as popular as a video game rpg
there are more reasons...but regardless, I know I can bring tons of experience, stories, and thousands of different ideas.

bottom line that I have learned from some of the most prevalent celebrities. If you do not change and roll with the times, you will be run over. I know the immediate future belongs to the micro economy that is the App economy. whether it is the Apple store / Android Market / facebook apps, etc. the future lies there. If I had the $$, time, and some team members then I could have translated Legion to a video game market too.

But it would be wrong. it wouldn't be Legion. Here is why: your imagination has no budget. Pen and paper RPGs will never truly be gone, just as kids will never tire of playing "cops n robbers" or any other imaginary games. Books will always be better than the movie, because your brain doesn't have a special effects budget to worry about.

Legion is and always will be different from CK or ST. That's fine.
...Cyberpunk has been in my head, in my my heart for well over 25 years. I love it. it is still my preferred genre to write in. Even as our days get closer and closer to the realities we have all played or read about in other cyberpunk media, I don't feel it is dead. I feel cyberpunk is about ready for a second renaissance.

No matter what... I am on this team! For better or worse, I still love it, and will continue to do what I do...

so who's with me??

(wow, turned into more of a rant than I wanted)

[Cory Trese]

I look forward to a time when we can collaborate with guest storytellers on StoryTellerEngine stories.

At this point in the process, we're not ready to engage like this. We have tried with the forum and several people but the process is too loose right now.

After Andrew and I have finished a few example STE plotlines I think we will be in a better spot to collaborate and instruct. The game's abilities are unfinished and negotiating that terrain and the game's data formats is a challenge enough for our brotherhood -- much less new outside authors.

Stay tuned as we work though these first few plotlines.

[smv1172]

That sounds awesome, I really like the idea of shifting territories that preserve the open-endedness of the game, I'm always a little sad when the sandbox gets closed.

[Tsueg]

Oct 3, 2011 19:11:34 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

CK does allow region map and ownership changes, to an extent that the game remains in balance.

One common critical comment about ST is that ownership / operation of a particular planet or urban zone cannot be * permanently modified* (in ST ... try buying a good ship somewhere after the planet has been blockaded for a year!)

So, in response to the criticism we added facilities to CK and StoryTeller that allow the changes to ownership.

We have also added that ability to upcoming Star Trader derivatives.

It is just hard to undo choices made at the very beginning. The cost is exponentially higher and those rules were cast in steel before the game was ever for sale.

I like that idea. It may be wise to not allow certain zones to be taken over though... Imagine how not-possible Mars would make it for their HQ to be won over for instance. Perhaps each faction would have a zone they would permanently control as a 'home zone'

[LordofSyn]

Oct 4, 2011 16:17:54 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

I look forward to a time when we can collaborate with guest storytellers on StoryTellerEngine stories.

At this point in the process, we're not ready to engage like this. We have tried with the forum and several people but the process is too loose right now.

After Andrew and I have finished a few example STE plotlines I think we will be in a better spot to collaborate and instruct. The game's abilities are unfinished and negotiating that terrain and the game's data formats is a challenge enough for our brotherhood -- much less new outside authors.

Stay tuned as we work though these first few plotlines.

@cory thank you for clarifying. I will be here, and you have several ways to contact me...now to finish my CK story!

[Cory Trese]

Oct 4, 2011 17:34:50 GMT -5 smv1172 said:

That sounds awesome, I really like the idea of shifting territories that preserve the open-endedness of the game, I'm always a little sad when the sandbox gets closed.

A sandbox game must include both the sand and the box.

Otherwise you are talking about a sandpile and that's a different beast.