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Post by tenbsmith on Nov 18, 2015 14:12:21 GMT -5
I need help deciding which to unlock first as I work my way through the Ferarai Lance.
Initially, I was targeting Paladin, so I could heal my peeps, but someone said they cost so many supply points that you couldn't get them on the field until late in any given mission.
Now I'm thinking Hydra as the easiest to unlock, so I'll probably do that.
comments welcome.
PS. Would be nice for the Req Tree to show SP requirements.
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Post by Cory Trese on Nov 18, 2015 14:30:59 GMT -5
Updated Req Tree to show SP requirements.
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Post by NoQuitt on Nov 18, 2015 14:48:32 GMT -5
You can definitely get a Paladin out consistently if you want, but it's expensive so it can be tricky. Sometimes you can swap for a Paladin right away and other times you will have to wait until later on in the mission.
Hydra or Neptune are solid choices. I suggest Hydra to start out for variety purposes, because the Neptune is kind of like a Soldier but on steroids.
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Post by xdesperado on Nov 18, 2015 14:48:37 GMT -5
I'm a Hydra fan especially when backed/paired with a Scout using Crippling Fire. They are pretty straightforward in usage and have some good gear that can also be used by Engineers and Soldiers. That being said you can't really go wrong getting Paladin unlocked. Even just Soldiers and Scouts do a good job killing Xeno but getting any Healing is very SP expensive without a Paladin.
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Post by tenbsmith on Nov 18, 2015 14:49:43 GMT -5
Question to the group, is the SP cost significantly lower for hydra than paladin? Better yet what are the costs?
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Post by NoQuitt on Nov 18, 2015 14:56:35 GMT -5
SP costs are raised based on the Templar's level.
Max costs:
Scout: 400 Soldier: 450 Hydra: 550 Neptune:550 Engineer: 650 Paladin: 650 Berserk: 650
They usually reach their max sp costs around midway through the campaign
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Post by tenbsmith on Nov 18, 2015 15:07:42 GMT -5
xdesperado, we must have been writing our last posts at the same time and I missed yours. Your logic makes sense so I may go back to Paladin, they don't cost that many more SP.
NoQuitt, thanks for the Max cost. Makes me wonder if for some missions you could save SP by switching a scout for a more SP expensive Engineer/Hydra/Paladin on the first turn. Or, do you have to pay the SP difference when you do those first turn switches.
Are there missions that require a certain type specialists? If so, at some point you'll have one assigned regardless of unlocks.
Are there missions that favor a certain type of specialist? If so, it would be ideal to have already unlocked that type.
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Post by ntsheep on Nov 18, 2015 15:14:32 GMT -5
You can have the Paladin unlocked by the end of the tutorial levels if you focus on it at any difficulty level. By choosing the hold mission of the Ferarai levels you can have one out on 2, by turn 6 if playing on Ironman. This a good example of planning ahead for the type of team you want. It can sometimes help to have a piece of paper and a pen handy to write out path and its cost. That's going to be one of the next updates I do to the guide. Putting in starting SP at a level and showing several paths for the tutorial.
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Post by xdesperado on Nov 18, 2015 15:16:27 GMT -5
Think Hydra is only Specialist required for some missions other than your Engineer. The Swap function requires the SP cost be paid immediately, if you swap say a Soldier for a Scout you'll get extra SP to spend later in level, but there is a limit to how much SP is available when starting a level so it isn't always possible to Swap for a Paladin or Berserk at start. Oh almost forgot, semi spoiler here but late campaign there are some Secondary Objectives on levels that only a Hydra can complete (love seeing my Hydra exclaim Now lets see a Neptune do that! When completing one of those )
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Post by ntsheep on Nov 18, 2015 15:16:57 GMT -5
xdesperado, we must have been writing our last posts at the same time and I missed yours. Your logic makes sense so I may go back to Paladin, they don't cost that many more SP. NoQuitt, thanks for the Max cost. Makes me wonder if for some missions you could save SP by switching a scout for a more SP expensive Engineer/Hydra/Paladin on the first turn. Or, do you have to pay the SP difference when you do those first turn switches. Are there missions that require a certain type specialists? If so, at some point you'll have one assigned regardless of unlocks. Are there missions that favor a certain type of specialist? If so, it would be ideal to have already unlocked that type. Yes, if there's a certain Templar type you need, you'll get one even if you haven't unlocked it yet. Hydra is one. There was a time in the game you also got a Berserker but that's been taken out.
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Post by ntsheep on Nov 18, 2015 15:26:27 GMT -5
Think Hydra is only Specialist required for some missions other than your Engineer. The Swap function requires the SP cost be paid immediately, if you swap say a Soldier for a Scout you'll get extra SP to spend later in level, but there is a limit to how much SP is available when starting a level so it isn't always possible to Swap for a Paladin or Berserk at start. Oh almost forgot, semi spoiler here but late campaign there are some Secondary Objectives on levels that only a Hydra can complete (love seeing my Hydra exclaim Now lets see a Neptune do that! When completing one of those ) The battle of which is better, Hydra or Neptune, use to be between people on the forum. Now the game itself has the two battling over who's best. I love it!
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Post by xdesperado on Nov 18, 2015 15:33:06 GMT -5
Think Hydra is only Specialist required for some missions other than your Engineer. The Swap function requires the SP cost be paid immediately, if you swap say a Soldier for a Scout you'll get extra SP to spend later in level, but there is a limit to how much SP is available when starting a level so it isn't always possible to Swap for a Paladin or Berserk at start. Oh almost forgot, semi spoiler here but late campaign there are some Secondary Objectives on levels that only a Hydra can complete (love seeing my Hydra exclaim Now lets see a Neptune do that! When completing one of those ) The battle of which is better, Hydra or Neptune, use to be between people on the forum. Now the game itself has the two battling over who's best. I love it! Well it's pretty obvious Hydra is best! There are certain things Only a Hydra can do, while Neptunes are just big semi mobile turrets (and usually not a smart as your average turret)
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Post by Cory Trese on Nov 18, 2015 15:35:08 GMT -5
Costs are actually this:
#define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_SCOUT 350 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_SOLDIER 400 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_ENGINEER 600 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_PALADIN 600 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_CAPTAIN 0 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_NEPTUNE 500 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_HYDRA 500 #define CHARACTER_TYPE_COST_BERSERK 500
(Berserk is showing 500 because I'm testing this change.)
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Post by ntsheep on Nov 18, 2015 15:40:11 GMT -5
Although I do tend to favor pulling out a Neptune more often than a Hydra. I've never really thought that one was better than the other. For the missions where a Hydra is needed, they are the King of the castle and I do love seeing those flames and stupid xeno that walk right into them. To me a perfect team would be 2 Soldiers, a Hydra, and a Neptune. Just like the squad setup in Aliens.
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Post by xdesperado on Nov 18, 2015 15:39:53 GMT -5
Cory Trese bringing Berserk cost down to same level as Neptune and Hydra will definitely be a great incentive for more of us to at least try them. Even though I've unlocked/recruited them on a couple saves I've never actually deployed one because of cost
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