Before I start ANOTHER new group, I want opinions on wether this is a viable tactic or not.
I'm seriously considering making a Dex/shield Vraes. I know, I know... Normal convention says this isn't viable into E2. BUT- I'm thinking of this strategy and think it could work for me:
Vraes with the strongest 1ap dagger available, or dual wield for hard targets. His goal would be to push Crushing Blow up to very high levels as soon as possible in order to offset the increasing armor totals. Focus on SSk and Mastery with points into BoS for movement and dodge. I've always had an issue with him standing there and getting hit and I hate it to no end... This build would be extremely defensively minded, butI don't know about Phalanx Shield, because he would need the flexibility to still DW effectively if he needed to.
I would use Selen as my armor remover and would also be built for evasion. Since I've seen her actually tank harder than big V, I want to see just how well she could shine as a primary tank that strips defenses away for V to come in and harass. I would likely end up having her use both a 1 and 2 ap for Dual Wield once armors get too high to handle effectively.
I plan on using Fyona as a skirmisher, raising only ZS for fringe offense, while putting a HEAVY emphasis on Strickening. This will become more valuable than any other talent on the field when used in conjunction with Vincent's Thundering Blades. She would also dabble in Shield of Cortias for added defense for the über tanks V and Selen.
Vincent would really only focus on getting Thundering Blades up, while debuffing with FF and FA, to further suppress archers and cripple enemies.
I guess the entire focus of this build ends up making V as evasive as a QsD Selen (almost) while keeping damage up as high as possible using Strickening, Punishing Blades, and a high level Thundering Blades. I think that by boosting CB to reckless damage levels, he will still be hitting almost as hard as using strength weapons, maybe more when everything is working in concert with one another.
If anyone has tried something like this, let me know how it worked, otherwise what do you think about this loadout?
These Dex-based Vraes builds seems a bit crazy. Why don't you pump up his intelligence, give him a good haircut and put him in a Brooks Brothers Suit while you're at it. :-)
In any event, here are my thoughts.
Maybe BoS should be more of a focus... it raises dodge. NM for melee, BoS for melee & ranged. Initially, I thought BoS wasn't worth it, but I really like it on my current Vraes build where I'm focusing on Lore based talents to maximize efficient SP use.
Dual wielding with one dagger with high parry and the other high accuracy might decrease your need for a shield and help you overcome armor.
You need a sustainable plan that allows you to increase Dex across all levels. If you pump too many points into Dex early, what you gonna do when you max Dex out?
Last Edit: Jul 1, 2014 12:44:18 GMT -5 by tenbsmith
Post by contributor on Jul 1, 2014 12:58:57 GMT -5
I don't know what difficulty you're playing on. I think what you have, might work well for Normal and Hard difficulty. If you really want to create a Vraes who doesn't get hit it seems like going with Phalanx Shield and then Fyona's Shield of Cortias would make for massive amounts of Parry. Archers might still be a problem. In which case you could really boost Vincent's Frigid Air. The big question then is how to get enemies Dodge and Parry down. You could try pure focus on boosting your Accuracy which would mean lots of Thundering Blades. That would go well with Fyona doing Strickening, but then her points get spread pretty thin and she is primarily a buff bot. I would definitely recommend a Vraes with Savage Sweep over Crushing Blow in this case. I've told myself I'm only going to use Crushing Blow again if I'm using both Choking Ash and Pinning Shot. So maybe you could do Savage Sweep and Ferocity for those moments when you really need to get through armor?
contributor I guess I had forgotten about the accuracy issue sort of.... I was hoping the combined accuracy bonus from NM, TB , and Strickening would be enough to carry me through..... Unless you think Selen could be if better use with both blades and a bow, just using TB to offset the spreading of the points.... or I could just use her as bow support with PS and forget about stripping armor altogether, just relying on Strickening to lower resistances to the same point. I'm not too worried about using Fy as support, that is what I was expecting of her- but I did want points into Zealous Strikes to capitalize on Strickening bc of the added Holy Damage it provides, just using her as fringe mop up for the back line. So hard to decide what to do.... For me, Vraes must have CB for me to really want to do this build- I don't want to get to the point where I'm not penetrating armor anymore, and CB is just the trick for me to do it.
This actually begs the question- what is the best way to capitalize on Strickening? Have other people had issues making a cohesive group around it? If not, people should post an effective build for this talent.
Post by contributor on Jul 1, 2014 13:52:09 GMT -5
Yeah, it's always a trade off. I think that if you went with dual blades for him (thus using Stone Skin and BoS) and used a lot of Shield of Cortias it could be a good build and you could still use Savage Sweep. With Selen using Punishing Blades you will get armor strippage. I've actually got the same group sitting in the Forgotten Waystation (Just after escape from Redhill). I haven't allocated their XP yet and you're making me rethink it all again. I may go with a new dexterity group. With this group I think I actually have the hardest time deciding what to do with Vincent. Do I go melee or AoE ranged damage for him? I've never gone all melee before. I have to look at John Robinson's tables. Maybe I will actually make him a buffer until he gets to level 18 and finally try that spell with him.
We should make a group challenge thread... Someone post a build idea then we see who comes up with the best version. This trial and error could be crowd sourced..... Take the guess work out of the game (slightly)
Post by contributor on Jul 1, 2014 15:34:21 GMT -5
Interesting idea. I think I've settled on a build for this group. It's on my Mac which means I probably won't be playing it as much, but we'll see. If you start a thread for this group (Dex Vraes with Vince, Selen and Fifi.) I'll post my info over there.
Vraes is going Dual-Wielding with light blades and BoS, SS and Savage Sweep. He may throw in some NM.
Selen will balance QsD, PB and FB with maybe a few points in DoS eventually. Getting a few more move points is huge.
Vincent is going all Thundering Blades and Flash Freeze until he can get to his level 18 attack spell.
Fyona is actually going to try Battlefield Devotion, Shield of Cotias and I'm still waffling between Zealous Strikes and Strickening. Strickening is hard because you have to spread your talent points a lot to make it work. I've got a little time to decide.
I'm a little worried that the group is going to be a late bloomer and might not be that much fun through episode 1 and then they might get their buts kicked in episode 2. They're also going to have a hard
This is an update of the "Travelers" build I posted on page 2 of this thread. I believe they were level 7 back then; they just reached level 11. Things are going well. We’re part way through the Vermin Lair.
This group continues to emphasize buffs/curses, efficient use of SP, and ability to hit without empowered attacks (e.g., Savage Sweep, Aimed Shot, Smiting Blow). Buffs over curses because you can always buff all 4 heroes but frequently only curse one enemy. Keeping cursing and empowered attack Talents at lower levels allows me to use them more frequently without excessive SP drain.
Kyera is skipping ranged, damage dealing Talents. Vraes may skip Juggernaut, Ferocity and Leadership based Talents. Tamilin and Kjartan will probably use their high-level AOE Talents.
Vraes11 Attributes: S 8, D 4, C 8, W 5, I 5, K 3 Skills: Bl 3, Ham 3, Pol 7, Lea 1, Lor 7 Talents: Crush 2, Savage 1, Stone 2, Natural 4, Burst 1
Kyera11 Attributes: S 6, D 3, C 7, W 4, I 7, K 6 (+4) Skills: Ham 8, Pol 2, Inv 3, Conj 5, Lor 3 Talents: Smiting 2, Myshana’s 2, Ethereal 1, Warder’s 4, Purifying 1
Tamilin1 Attributes: S 5, D 9, C 5, W 4, I 6, K 4 Skills: Blade 1, Bow 7, Lore 6, Secur 3, Stealth 4 Talents: Aimed 1, Farsight 2, Precision 1, Disarm 1, Deadly 4, Black 2
Kjartan11 Attributes: S 3, D 4, C 5, W 7, I 6, K 8 Skills: Pole 2, Sorcery 6, Conj 6, Lore 2 Talents: Firebolt 2, Choking 2, Pureflame 2, BurningB 4
Last Edit: Aug 11, 2014 8:27:12 GMT -5 by tenbsmith
Wow. Just wow. Just got to my first fight after the Waystation.... I was fortunate to have leveled up the extra time during the escape. Vraes is equipped with a hunting knife and a training sword until I can specialize my weaponry in Oska... Both points went into Crushing Blow for big V. First CB went 56 damage second swing went 46 damage. No curse from Selen, no added damage from TB. I'm really excited about this one! I actually think I'm going to have Selen use both bow and dagger, but to help offset the accuracy, she will use the 3ap version and curse dodge/parry with PS. I'll make that thread for all this tomorrow, contributor, unless you wanted to- I'm eager to see how SSw works for you in contrast to CB.
This is an update of the “Travelers” build--they run fast and far without many stops to replenish spirit. See my 7/1 post for a detailed description of the build heuristic. (Previously known as the "Shadowfax" build).
They’ve just reached Riven Field and level 14. At level 14 most heroes get 1 point each for attributes, skills and talents (Kjartan forgoes the skills point). I’d love feedback/advice on assigning points.
Vraes is getting hit most of the time by Arhaive soldiers. What do you think of increasing dodge by adding a point to Burst of Speed and another to Warder’s Shield? Will it be enough to make those bastards miss more?
Vraes13 Attributes: S 8, D 4, C 8, W 5, I 6, K 3 Skills: Bl 3, Ham 3, Pol 8, Lea 1, Lor 7 Talents: Crush 2, Savage 2, Stone 2, Natural 4, Burst 1
Kyera13 Attributes: S 6, D 3, C 7, W 4, I 8, K 6 Skills: Ham 8, Pol 2, Inv 3, Conj 6, Lor 3 Talents: Smiting 2, Myshana’s 3, Ethereal 1, Warder’s 4, Purifying 1
Tamilin13 Attributes: S 5, D 9, C 6, W 4, I 6, K 4 Skills: Blade 1, Bow 8, Lore 6, Secur 3, Stealth 4 Talents: Aimed 1, Farsight 2, Precision 1, Disarm 1, Deadly 5, Black 2
Kjartan13 Attributes: S 3, D 4, C 5, W 7, I 7, K 8 Skills: Pole 2, Sorcery 7, Conj 7, Lore 2 Talents: Firebolt 3, Choking 2, Pureflame 2, BurningB 4
Last Edit: Aug 11, 2014 8:25:48 GMT -5 by tenbsmith
New characters are always fun to think about, and since Kincaid made his debut literally 15 minutes before I got into bed last night, I was up late thinking about how to best put him into a group. Here's a few of my ideas, feel free to add yours as well.
Full on skirmishers- all new characters with a focus on having as many teammates as able to attack things at both ranges as possible. Kincaid with a 2ap blade and throwing knives, Vincent with storm strike, charged speed, lightning spear and thundering blades. Selen using a 1ap knife and a bow using dual curses like fallen's let's play. With Fyona in a bruiser/mbt/defensive role. I envisioned everyone working their way around her in a whirlwind of doom and daggers, slicing up everything not bludgeoned by Fyona.
Twin Dex tanks with Selen and Kincaid rocking the house up front being supported by Kyera and KJ for danged damage and curse support. Possible to switch out for Vincent for more AoE/curse/extra skirmisher
Full ranged group defending Fyona- Kincaid as mop up skirmish alongside Vincent- AoE and the meanest sword he can carry (Lukai's blade and Storm Strike anyone?) With Selen on Pinning Shot for -ap
Fyona as main tank, Kincaid as Dex tank, Vincent as full curse support/archer suppression, with Tam as critical hit specialist/late game AoE support.
Try a group that is crazy focused on defense- Sure Parry, and other defensive talents for Kincaid, Shield of Cortias and CD for Fy, Selen focused on bows and PS, with Vincent on curse support and taking archers out of the game.
My head hurts in such a good way =) I'm trying the twin Dex tanks with Vincent and Ky...
It's too bad we can't see the entire list of the talents through rank 10 from the talent menu- some of Kincaids talents look very similar and it would be great if we could see the end results of the talents- this would make group decisions much easier to start thinking about earlier in the game.