Ship Combat talents outside of combat

[sigurdcole]

Hi there!

It seems odd that we can invest heavily in talents that repair damage or heal crew in combat, but I don't see a way to use them outside of combat. This seems...immersion breaking? Is there a reason why my Doctor can't patch up crew outside of combat, or my Mechanic can't tweak the engines back up?

Or have I missed an interface somewhere?

Thank you!

[drspendlove]

I mean, it is a little bit odd. However, I think the implications is that they're expending some kind of limited resource during emergencies (combat) and otherwise have their hands full passing deep space ops problems.

[Cory Trese]

Sorry to hear that you think this is breaking the immersion for you.

We will do our best to continue to expand the game and offer new and exciting Talent options.

Thank you for playing!

[sigurdcole]

Aug 14, 2018 18:51:32 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

Sorry to hear that you think this is breaking the immersion for you.

We will do our best to continue to expand the game and offer new and exciting Talent options.

Thank you for playing!

I was more wondering, why not? Is there a balance reason, or a structural reason? The talents are overall pretty great, but I think this could add more utility to the talents, and make them more attractive to non-combat traders.

[drspendlove]

In terms of utility, I think this is actually really strong as-is. Having it usable outside of combat would be overwhelmingly good -- too good.

[Cory Trese]

We tested it for several months both ways and determined, after careful study and comparison of the resulting game mechanics that the solution we picked in the end was superior for the player's experience within the game.

[fallen]

Balance is a big part of it. Avoiding anti-patterns.

Everyone is hopped up during combat. Life and death situation. This is the time to regain Morale with a great speech. 3 weeks later after daily duty ... no one wants to hear your speech!

Wounds are fresh after a combat. This is the time for doctors to act. 3 weeks later, the open wound may have healed, but the damage is done and the person needs to see a doctor. Living close to a Void Engine takes its toll on spacers.

You need to act after combat.

[sigurdcole]

Thanks for the detailed responses! I'll take your word for it and continue to explore!

[falconne]

Aug 14, 2018 21:33:14 GMT -5 fallen said:

Balance is a big part of it. Avoiding anti-patterns.

Everyone is hopped up during combat. Life and death situation. This is the time to regain Morale with a great speech. 3 weeks later after daily duty ... no one wants to hear your speech!

Wounds are fresh after a combat. This is the time for doctors to act. 3 weeks later, the open wound may have healed, but the damage is done and the person needs to see a doctor. Living close to a Void Engine takes its toll on spacers.

You need to act after combat.

You can still get into combat again later and use those talents to heal HP or morale lost from a previous event. I find I get into unnecessary battles on purpose just to use those talents to bring my crew and ship up to 100%. I've also been bothered by this inconsistency and I know it's for balance. It's hard to come up with a compromise that maintains narrative consistency without being unbalanced. 

[fallen]

Thanks for the feedback!

[sigurdcole]

Upon some reflection (and a lot more play), I do wish that there was some amount of passive recovery that was affected by crew skill pools and ship equipment.

For example, if my ship has a Hospital module, shouldn't it be able to treat my own crew over time?

I understand that this is A) super wonky and B) a C-list priority at best, and you have a substantial dev roadmap already. It would be nice if, say, a Doctor on staff could help crew recover from 91% to 100% health, with the floor decreasing as the ship gained more Medical Rating.

It would also be neat to have a ship module for, say, a Maintenance Bay, which could boost ship Repair pools and offer the same benefit to components (though, arguably, not hull damage).

[fallen]

Thanks for the feedback. It isn't something we will be adding to the game however. Travel in the void is not going to be a time for recovery.

[drspendlove]

In other words, the healing over time is implicit. You'd be dying due to the small everyday issues and dangers you encounter without medical help. The fact that your health doesn't steadily decrease while passing all of your event checks is the medical team's work!

[John Robinson]

Aug 20, 2018 4:01:09 GMT -5 falconne said:

You can still get into combat again later and use those talents to heal HP or morale lost from a previous event. I find I get into unnecessary battles on purpose just to use those talents to bring my crew and ship up to 100%. I've also been bothered by this inconsistency and I know it's for balance. It's hard to come up with a compromise that maintains narrative consistency without being unbalanced. 

sigurdcole , falconne
My current ship has 4 doctors, 2 combat hospitals and an advanced medical bay installed. 

So why am I not on the change it band-wagon?

    Chaesin Doctors do not fly as crew on ships, they can only be found dirtside.  Many injuries, and diseases simply cannot
be healed by regular doctors.  Urban zone docs are part of the Chaesin healing cult passed down hundreds of years. 
Notice how different they are in era-3 during the crimson pox. 

    A twenty story hospital, with advanced medical machinery, thousands of staff.  No ship can get anywhere near that. 

    With the greatest respect to all thread contributors.  This is much ado about nothing. 
Flying to any nearby friendly planet with medical facilities is the quickest, cheapest,  and easiest way to get the crew back to 100%.

falconne    I like the way you think!   +1k  

Flipping logic upside down can have surprising positive results.  I try all kinds of crazy STF combos just to see what happens.  

Timing is always critical if you go that way.

For example at which point during the next ship battle would I use one of these talents?  (Which round to escape)

Am I risking more damage and death rolls to more valuable crew that went unscathed in the last battle?

I can take great care of my crew for years, get to the next port and a bunch of the pansies quit on me after one ship battle,
so there is a real tipping point to this approach.

Solace in Battle	doc(11)	Purges your Ship of both Crew and Ship Crippling Effects, Restores Doctor Skill worth of Morale to 20 Crew
Treat Wounded	doc(1)	Heals 3 crew, or up to (Medical Rating x 3) on ships with advanced medical facilities.
		Each patient gains 20 + Doctor Skill in HP
Medical Ward	Med(5)	Upon defeating an enemy ship, heal 3 crew, or up to (Medical Rating x 3) on ships with advanced medical
		facilities. Each patient gains 10 + Doctor Skill in HP

[sigurdcole]

Aug 20, 2018 17:02:55 GMT -5 drspendlove said:

In other words, the healing over time is implicit. You'd be dying due to the small everyday issues and dangers you encounter without medical help. The fact that your health doesn't steadily decrease while passing all of your event checks is the medical team's work!

I mean, I can see the argument that Health damage represents major injuries that a good Doctor may be able to stabilize, but not treat. Or, to take that even farther, that the facilities represent stabilizing methods, rather than active treatment. If nothing else, this isn't Star Trek and there aren't replicators, so even with facilities a doctor would have to be very selective about their pharmacopoeia.

However, I don't see how this argument holds water when we have a Talent to gain reputation by being a hospital ship.