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Post by vindroid on Jul 30, 2012 4:34:21 GMT -5
Ok, so I read the manual and all and I still dont quite catch how the turns work. Everybody has their AP and everyone spending those APs is a combat round. But how is the order in that round decided? It gets kinda confusing when I move and still have ap and the turn passes to someone else and the pop up comes up and I see that I'm somewhere on the list, some are not (because they are out of ap and will not move again until next round?). How is this list between rounds determined? I'm pretty sure I've seen moments where I was first on the list but someone else moved first and vice versa. A clearer in-game indicator would be nice.
Speaking of which, there was this game on PSP called metal gear acid, basically mgs but turn based strategy (with mgs1 stealth rules). Basically each character turn you get to make 2 or 3 actions and to act you need cards that has costs. Then between turns there's a 'timer' that ticks down all the costs that all characters on the map has and the first one to hit 0 gets to move again. Uhh not sure why i blurted this out...
Anyway, I got the elite but I'm china right now and getting the elite version sure was troublesome. I got star traders elite by using an app that fakes the market location and purchasing it with my cc (really satisfied with it but just browsed the forums just now and found that it's still much deeper than I thought so I might ditch CK for a while and go back to ST again). When I tried to get CK weeks later, I keep getting rejected. Spent hours trying to find out why. Thought it was the market sim faker but turns out it was my card. Worth it though.
Edit: Uh, the walking animation update looks great but isn't it...a little too slow? I've always found the walking abit too tedious even with the auto dpad and double click destination when you're already on the area you want to be in. It's the waiting. I found it more tolerable on ST.
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Post by grävling on Jul 30, 2012 5:27:23 GMT -5
Ok, so I read the manual and all and I still dont quite catch how the turns work. Everybody has their AP and everyone spending those APs is a combat round. But how is the order in that round decided? It gets kinda confusing when I move and still have ap and the turn passes to someone else and the pop up comes up and I see that I'm somewhere on the list, some are not (because they are out of ap and will not move again until next round?). How is this list between rounds determined? I'm pretty sure I've seen moments where I was first on the list but someone else moved first and vice versa. A clearer in-game indicator would be nice. The 'who gets to move ahead of somebody else' is called initiative. In the combat screen, it is the last column, labelled Init If you have the initiative (on someone) , you move before he does, and your Init value will be higher than his. I am not sure what stats are factored into the equation that determines who has the initiative, but stealth is one of them, and there is some large random factor involved, because in the same fight, in different rounds it is usual for the initiative order to change. You can buy implants that increase your chances of having the initiative. Or, over time, your stats will improve to the point that you usually go first even without any cybernetic help. You are correct that monsters drop out of this list as their AP drops to 0. They will return next round, when the whole initiative for that round is recalculated. Within the round, no matter what the phase, the order is such as was determined at the start of the round. So you won't see monsters 'lower on the list' going before ones higher on the list. But it can sure look like this. What you will often see is that monsters higher on the list choose to do nothing (for a cost of one AP). This is usually because they are already in range to use their weapon, but they don't have enough APs to use it. So if they have 2 APs, but their gun needs 3, they could choose to make a single step or a double step -- so they remain on the list, but what they actually do is just wait for the next round. The other thing that you can see happen a lot -- especially when fighting drones -- is that the monster has a lot more AP than you do. So you run out of AP, and cannot do a move -- because once you are down under 3 AP you are done for this whole round. This means, by the way, that if you have 5AP and you want to get the most movement out of them, you need to take your 2AP short step of 2 (or two short steps of 1) first, and then take your normal move with 3 AP. If you do it in the other order, you will go from 5AP to 2AP, and the game will say that this is all you get in a round because you are under 3. You will miss out on 2 squares of movement. Meanwhile, the drones (or some other monster, but it is most noticable with drones) have plenty of AP. So they aren't done. Even if they started the round having lost the initiative to you, they keep coming and attacking you until they are out of AP. So you may be sitting around with a worthless 2AP which you cannot use, and the drones are still whacking away at you. Both of these things can make it look like monsters are attackng in the wrong order, but it just appears that way. Does this explanation make sense? Let me know if you are still confused about this. Understanding how it works is essential to survival. and -- welcome to the forums. |
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Post by vindroid on Jul 30, 2012 7:22:14 GMT -5
Uhh see..the combat screen has only always showed me the physique and mental column. Even then, the mental column is partially blocked by the ready button. The numbers for mental was at least readable but the last patch hid it even more and today's patch almost completely blocked the mental column. I've never even seen initiative column. I'm on samsung galaxy s1 (i9000 i think) bought in hongkong. By the way, thanks for the 'below 3 ap and you dont get any more turns this round' tip. Didn't know that. Attachments:
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Post by fallen on Jul 30, 2012 9:40:20 GMT -5
vindroid - thanks for the screenshot. We will try to work on that UI to make it work better on small screens (always a challenge with tables!).
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Post by vindroid on Jul 30, 2012 10:22:32 GMT -5
Well, I think my SGS1 is a pretty common android phone, aside from SGS2. Is my phone screen considered small by now? I'm considering a samsung note but I'm waiting to see the note2.
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Post by grävling on Jul 30, 2012 10:37:17 GMT -5
I have a Samsung Galaxy S1 Gt-I9000 and I get more use out of my screen for combat than you do. This is my phone. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_Galaxy_SDoes yours look like that? When I play, the box with the stats goes all the way to the far right side of the screen. You seem to have a column on the far right side, roughly equal in width to the column on the far left side where your portrait and stats live, which isn't being used by the combat screen. So in the screenshot you posted you can see a little bit of building and a whole lot of road to the right. On my screen all of that is covered with combat stat information. It's bad that you aren't seeing the init column, but it is even worse that you aren't seeing the AP column. Without knowing the opponents' AP, you cannot properly plan your fight. |
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Post by vindroid on Jul 30, 2012 10:48:17 GMT -5
Yeah that's my phone. I was about to buy HTC desire but got the SGS1 instead. I'm not quite happy with the 'butt' though. I like symmetrical things and The rounded edges are too round imo but still a good phone.
Now that I think about it, SGS1 android support stopped at 2.3 os version right? Like a month ago I decided to try installing 4.0 with rooting and odin, etc. I havent found anything wrong so far other than the seemingly faster battery drain and laggy ui slides and it having to redraw at times. Could that be it? SGS1 with 4.0 instead of native 2.3? I havent done anything crazy with phone os and ui.
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Post by vindroid on Jul 30, 2012 11:11:59 GMT -5
Ok, I went to the android system settings and switch the fonts from normal to small then went to on a hacking rampage and got my heat to full bar and walked around. Then I checked the game settings and found that my combat notifications are set to large. I have no idea if this meant the damage/miss mesages only or also the combat initiative list but i turned off the settings anyway. Then I walked some more and got into a fight. This is what I got. Mental is visible now but not any of the rest. Just how many columns are there supposed to be? Attachments:
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Post by grävling on Jul 30, 2012 11:12:18 GMT -5
We will have to wait for Cory for the answer to whether that could be your problem. I am still running Android 2.2 here. I haven't found any way to upgrade my phone OS unless I connect to a Microsoft system (gee thanks, Samsung &%#&!! ), and I only have macs and linux boxes here.
My settings/about phone (I think this is what it says in English, my phone is speaking Swedish now) says:
Firmware version 2.2
Baseband version I900XXJPP
Kernel version 2.6.32.9 root@SE-S&08#1
Build number FROYO.XWJPA
what does yours say?
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Post by fallen on Jul 30, 2012 14:23:49 GMT -5
vindroid - just two more columns -- current AP and Initiative. You've got a ways to go! We will work on it
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Post by grävling on Jul 30, 2012 14:46:37 GMT -5
I have a Samsung Galaxy S1 Gt-I9000 and I get more use out of my screen for combat than you do. This is my phone. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_Galaxy_SDoes yours look like that? When I play, the box with the stats goes all the way to the far right side of the screen. You seem to have a column on the far right side, roughly equal in width to the column on the far left side where your portrait and stats live, which isn't being used by the combat screen. So in the screenshot you posted you can see a little bit of building and a whole lot of road to the right. On my screen all of that is covered with combat stat information. It's bad that you aren't seeing the init column, but it is even worse that you aren't seeing the AP column. Without knowing the opponents' AP, you cannot properly plan your fight. Actually my combat screen takes over the whole phone, so there is no column on the right or the left. |
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Post by grävling on Aug 3, 2012 21:37:45 GMT -5
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Post by vindroid on Aug 4, 2012 4:35:26 GMT -5
Looking forward to it! Never knew I was fighting blind.
Though I'm considering on moving to samsung note 2 when it comes out...lol.
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Post by grävling on Aug 4, 2012 4:48:35 GMT -5
Looking forward to it! Never knew I was fighting blind. Though I'm considering on moving to samsung note 2 when it comes out...lol. New release out now, try it and see if you get a better battle screen. |
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Post by vindroid on Aug 4, 2012 5:46:57 GMT -5
Just downloaded it from google play and I can see them now! Though someone with an init of 10 would have the number cut off a bit, but I can still tell it's a 10. Not a big deal. It's like 85% cut off.
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