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Post by Cory Trese on Oct 7, 2014 15:46:30 GMT -5
The only one I don't understand is this:
"Radiation bonuses help when colonizing planets."
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vylox
Consul
Colonial Minister of Clan Javat.
Posts: 89 
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Post by vylox on Oct 7, 2014 18:27:48 GMT -5
I did a little bit of testing in this direction on normal difficulty when I was deciding on and planning out my future progression on higher difficulties. Some things that I noticed. (This is not 100% accurate but though I would share) Ship level plays a role in shielding effectiveness. Appears to be +2 modifier for each level. Shielding 4 or higher is practically required for ship to ship combat against most of the AI ships. Shielding is more important than armor when invading Xeno colonies. Radiation bonuses are extremely useful when invading Xeno colonies. Radiation bonuses help when colonizing planets. Radiation bonuses help to increase values of rewards and reduce Xeno activity reports when exploring anomalies. While I have nothing exact, there does seem to be some use for decent shielding and the radiation modifiers for middle to late game tactics. That's really informative. When you say minimum 4 shielding, does that include this ship level shielding modifier you mentioned? Actually, the game devs have stated that ship level only affects HP, W-F, mass, and ship and captain skill points, so it's not very likely ship level affects shielding. Colony ships and invasion ships don't have anything that gives radiation bonuses. What exactly did you mean? There are upgrades for the ships (Crew, Propulsion, Bridge, Structure) that give bonuses to individual damage or shielding types. In Rychart for instance there is an upgrade that is listed as +14 Neutron. It provides +14 defense to your regular shielding against neutron damage. It also applies neutron damage to Hypersonic (torpedo) attacks. Sort of useless against most of the Xeno, however the bollish Xeno is quite weak against neutron shielding (you will take considerably less damage with increased shielding and neutron shielding combined) Whereas the Sidtax will take slightly increased torpedo damage from ships with a + to neutron shielding. While this is not mentioned, it is just something that I noticed. And when you build 20 ships that are almost identical with only an upgrade change to see the differences and then needing to track damage received and dealt from those same ships, some things might appear as one way. Against the Sidtax the ship that had the +14 neutron shielding took on average 10 less damage and did on average 7 more damage over the course of 100 turns of combat. A minimum of 4 shielding, in addition to the ship level and any upgrades that affect radiation (Neutron, Alpha, Beta, Gamma ect) Every Xeno has differing weapons, and from my experience all but the Xorga and Zenga have radiation damage added to their weapons. Does this help to clarify what I have noticed ? |
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vylox
Consul
Colonial Minister of Clan Javat.
Posts: 89
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Post by vylox on Oct 7, 2014 18:44:20 GMT -5
The only one I don't understand is this: "Radiation bonuses help when colonizing planets." Every single planet has it's own radiation value i would assume. When colonizing, i have noticed that it appears (might just be the RNG being nice to me repeadetly) that colonizing ships with 9+ shielding get better rolls when colonizing. while this is an assumption on my part, and could be entirely inaccurate, it is something that i have noticed. To the point where i have on several plays attempted to verify this. Using the same trio (Thulun Cadar and Rychart for the testing purposes) and starting multiple different games on the same map. It appears that colony ships with higher base shielding get better rolls through the RNG. I however have not done more than check through around 200 colonies. Using identical parameters for the ships with only changing the shields value. I believe that the Invasion sk8ll of a captian might also play a factor, however i have not done any checking on that particular hunch. again i could be wrong, but this is something that i noticed. and when you colonize the same planet, on the same turn of 100 different plays, and thereis a marked difference in the results that points to certain conclusions. Especially when the target planets have small variances to their RNG ( 9-15 minerals 9-15 quality on one, 7-18q, 7-18m, 4-12q with 7-18m. 2-12q with 2-12m. and a couple others of similar range values) |
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Post by khamya9 on Nov 25, 2014 12:32:11 GMT -5
I too have been wondering how to decide which radiation shielding to use, and how to determine when it is appropriate. Aside from references to radiation damage and that some xenos use it, there does not seem to be any information on how to optimize your protection. I was hoping that bumping up your sensor values might give some feedback on xeno ship capabilities but no luck so far. It seems that all you can do at this point is make a leap of faith and hope you have chosen wisely. Some feedback during combat to indicate if you have taken radiation damage in addition to/instead of conventional damage would be extremely groovy. Thanks for the feedback. I will work on improving this. When you say "improving" and not "adding" it implies there is some way to know currently. What are those/that way(s)? Do the xenos always use the same types or does it change from game to game? Do they use just one or two and three types? I can't see making six (if they use just one), 36 (if they use two), or god help us 198 ( if they use three types) designs with different shielding just to take a few dozen hits each and every game. There has to be a better way. Also, a couple powers mention "radiation" without naming a specific type. How does that work? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2014 3:58:49 GMT -5
That's really informative. When you say minimum 4 shielding, does that include this ship level shielding modifier you mentioned? Actually, the game devs have stated that ship level only affects HP, W-F, mass, and ship and captain skill points, so it's not very likely ship level affects shielding. Colony ships and invasion ships don't have anything that gives radiation bonuses. What exactly did you mean? There are upgrades for the ships (Crew, Propulsion, Bridge, Structure) that give bonuses to individual damage or shielding types. In Rychart for instance there is an upgrade that is listed as +14 Neutron. It provides +14 defense to your regular shielding against neutron damage. It also applies neutron damage to Hypersonic (torpedo) attacks. Sort of useless against most of the Xeno, however the bollish Xeno is quite weak against neutron shielding (you will take considerably less damage with increased shielding and neutron shielding combined) Whereas the Sidtax will take slightly increased torpedo damage from ships with a + to neutron shielding. While this is not mentioned, it is just something that I noticed. And when you build 20 ships that are almost identical with only an upgrade change to see the differences and then needing to track damage received and dealt from those same ships, some things might appear as one way. Against the Sidtax the ship that had the +14 neutron shielding took on average 10 less damage and did on average 7 more damage over the course of 100 turns of combat. A minimum of 4 shielding, in addition to the ship level and any upgrades that affect radiation (Neutron, Alpha, Beta, Gamma ect) Every Xeno has differing weapons, and from my experience all but the Xorga and Zenga have radiation damage added to their weapons. Does this help to clarify what I have noticed ? Interesting. So certain upgrades which state increased defense of certain rad typesalso increase radiation damage. |
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Nov 26, 2014 9:41:32 GMT -5
If an upgrade says +x Radiation Shielding, I thought it meant a broad +x to ALL radiation defenses.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2014 6:17:16 GMT -5
If an upgrade says +x Radiation Shielding, I thought it meant a broad +x to ALL radiation defenses. It does. Its only when it says +x gamma shielding or alpha shielding that it doesn't apply to all. Keep in mind though, the more broad shielding bonuses are much more minor than bonuses that increase shielding for one or two types of radiation. |
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Post by khamya9 on Dec 1, 2014 13:58:23 GMT -5
That's really informative. When you say minimum 4 shielding, does that include this ship level shielding modifier you mentioned? Actually, the game devs have stated that ship level only affects HP, W-F, mass, and ship and captain skill points, so it's not very likely ship level affects shielding. Colony ships and invasion ships don't have anything that gives radiation bonuses. What exactly did you mean? There are upgrades for the ships (Crew, Propulsion, Bridge, Structure) that give bonuses to individual damage or shielding types. In Rychart for instance there is an upgrade that is listed as +14 Neutron. It provides +14 defense to your regular shielding against neutron damage. It also applies neutron damage to Hypersonic (torpedo) attacks. Sort of useless against most of the Xeno, however the bollish Xeno is quite weak against neutron shielding (you will take considerably less damage with increased shielding and neutron shielding combined) Whereas the Sidtax will take slightly increased torpedo damage from ships with a + to neutron shielding. While this is not mentioned, it is just something that I noticed. And when you build 20 ships that are almost identical with only an upgrade change to see the differences and then needing to track damage received and dealt from those same ships, some things might appear as one way. Against the Sidtax the ship that had the +14 neutron shielding took on average 10 less damage and did on average 7 more damage over the course of 100 turns of combat. A minimum of 4 shielding, in addition to the ship level and any upgrades that affect radiation (Neutron, Alpha, Beta, Gamma ect) Every Xeno has differing weapons, and from my experience all but the Xorga and Zenga have radiation damage added to their weapons. Does this help to clarify what I have noticed ? Something seems bugged about this. Shielding should not be increasing damage. I wonder if it is just your small sample size, or if there is a bug, because it is totally illogical that adding shields ever increases your damage, unless you're ramming the enemy. Also, only increasing the damage with torpedoes seems suspicious. That said, have you observed that the xenos ALWAYSuse the same radiation? If so, do you have a comprehensive or partial list which xenos use what radiation? Have you tested if the bollish only use neutron or do they use lots of neutron and some gamma/etc? |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 1, 2014 17:34:12 GMT -5
There are upgrades for the ships (Crew, Propulsion, Bridge, Structure) that give bonuses to individual damage or shielding types. In Rychart for instance there is an upgrade that is listed as +14 Neutron. It provides +14 defense to your regular shielding against neutron damage. It also applies neutron damage to Hypersonic (torpedo) attacks. Sort of useless against most of the Xeno, however the bollish Xeno is quite weak against neutron shielding (you will take considerably less damage with increased shielding and neutron shielding combined) Whereas the Sidtax will take slightly increased torpedo damage from ships with a + to neutron shielding. While this is not mentioned, it is just something that I noticed. And when you build 20 ships that are almost identical with only an upgrade change to see the differences and then needing to track damage received and dealt from those same ships, some things might appear as one way. Against the Sidtax the ship that had the +14 neutron shielding took on average 10 less damage and did on average 7 more damage over the course of 100 turns of combat. A minimum of 4 shielding, in addition to the ship level and any upgrades that affect radiation (Neutron, Alpha, Beta, Gamma ect) Every Xeno has differing weapons, and from my experience all but the Xorga and Zenga have radiation damage added to their weapons. Does this help to clarify what I have noticed ? Something seems bugged about this. Shielding should not be increasing damage. I wonder if it is just your small sample size, or if there is a bug, because it is totally illogical that adding shields ever increases your damage, unless you're ramming the enemy. Also, only increasing the damage with torpedoes seems suspicious. That said, have you observed that the xenos ALWAYSuse the same radiation? If so, do you have a comprehensive or partial list which xenos use what radiation? Have you tested if the bollish only use neutron or do they use lots of neutron and some gamma/etc? It's either a bug, or Cory forgot to put in the damage bonuses. Certain radiation types apply to certain attacks. Alpha and beta radiation apples to gun attack. Shielding and damage bonuses for these types of radiation will only help defend against and attack with guns. Neutron, Theta and Gamma apply to torpedo only. I am also confused about which AIs use which type of radiation in what quantities. Perhaps their preferred radiation could be listed in the AI description in the future, or individual ships could be scanned for their radiation and shielding bonuses with a high enough sensor. |
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