How does a Colony operate? Running the numbers.
May 26, 2014 14:42:10 GMT -5
ncaoa and Officer Genious like this
Post by John Robinson on May 26, 2014 14:42:10 GMT -5
If I do not understand a Colony how will I ever understand an Empire? What can I do to answer that question?
The numbers provided in the UI are there to help me play the game. I feel like the kid in the classroom who wants to raise his hand
but doesn't know the answer.
I started by reviewing and taking notes on the threads in the ST 4x forum. Next I used the Proboards search feature
to search for any threads that contained comments from Cory or Andrew and copy pasted them into my notes. Next I
copied all the descriptions from the in game library. I also played small games with multiple colonies to get a feel for the research tree
and politics. I still didn't quite understand how a colony really works. This thread is my attempt to find out.
This test is with a single Cadar colony without landing the other 2 hive ships. Why?
I want to isolate the inner workings from the huge political side and examine how the basic numbers work.
Here is the information I got from the Cadar Colony and Empire Summary screen shots.
The column marked ? indicates the questions numbered below.
Questions Column:
? 1 . Cadar has a quality of 17. The Empire Summary displays 1/17. If a second colony had a quality of 10 would it read 2/27 ?
? 2. Cadar Spice 5/1 means 1 spice out of a maximum of 5 is being refined. What relationship does that have to current morale of 10?
We know that a Spice Festival will raise moral by +1 or +2 points. A Spice Den is described as "Entertain 5 Population" and each one
you build will subtract 1 from the total the colony has available. But what does that really mean? If you have a Spice Den, 5 of
the population must become unhappy before you lose a single morale point?
The Empire Summary shows the total empire wide units of Spice being refined why is that important? If the Average Empire Morale is low
knowing the total spice available could be more helpful. For example on the Empire Summary Spice 10/30 would be 10 refined 30 total.
? 3. On the Empire Summary: 9/10 Colony $. What is this, how does it relate to other statistics, why is it important?
? 4. Empire Summary shows a total of 2 factories have been built. We know each factory requires $10/Turn maintenance. When we
look at Cadar there is only 1 active. According to the Library each population unit = $14 Turn. Each Active factory = 1 CP.
Every CP not in use to build something = $10. The Starport generates 2 CP for 2 Population, does that mean it generates 1 for 1?
Cadar gets a +2 CP bonus. So here is the question:
a) 10% of 30 = 3. Is that why my Maintenance Rate is 97% in the Empire Status Screen?
Maintenance Discount was described as being 20% for colonies with morale equal to 10. Where am I going wrong?
b) Why does Cadar show a profit of +33 and maintenance of -9? Shouldn't that be +48 Profit and -27 for maintenance?
The Empire Summary displays Busy/Idle CP as 0/2 why is that not 0/3 to match Cadar Prime? There are no upgrades under construction.
? 5. Income and Profit. On the Empire Status I have a profit of $2. Cadar is showing a profit of $33.
The implied income of Cadar is the total of profit plus maintenance meaning the income for Cadar is $42.
The Economy displayed on the Empire Status is 44. How does this relate to Cadar and why are they $2 different?
? 6. Ships: Who is paying for them? I don't see where the money is being subtracted from. Does the 33/33 mean that
what it costs to maintain the ships followed by what I am actually paying? In turn 2 none of my ships are in green zone
orbit around Cadar Prime.
a) Am I only charged for maintenance when a ship is in a green zone not a red one?
b) Is the maintenance cost suspended once a ship is 100% fueled and repaired?
Turn 3 I performed no actions in turn 2 and simply tapped end turn to see what would happen.
The only thing that happened is my treasury increased $2 from $ 1,252 to $1,254 the rest of the displays remained unchanged.
I began to build a Mine. The Colony display changed immediately showing my treasury reduced to $954 from 1,254 and $24/-9 profit/maintenance
down from $ 33/-9.
a) Why did I only lose $9 (33-24 = 9) shouldn't that be a drop of $10 to reflect the 1 CP being used in the mine construction?
Nothing changed on the Empire Summary display.
(Mines build for 15 cp +$300 and cost $5 maintenance)
Now I brought the fleet into the green zone orbit of Cadar Prime and tapped end turn.
Turn 4 Now I have 2 Templar Defenders, 1 Explorer and 1 Hive ship in orbit. Cadar Prime's screen remains the same except the
Treasury is now $931 so something cost me $23 (954-931). However looking at the Empire Summary there is a big change;
a) How can three ships have a maintenance of $11 per turn and only increase ship $ by 14?
b) Does colony morale 10 apply a 20% maintenance discount to ships in orbit?
The ships have been sitting idle in space and I want to get a handle on repair rates;
Each Templar Defender has a Hull of 104/152 or 68% and fuel 67/82 or 81%.
The Explorer has a Hull of 92/92 100% and fuel 69/82 or 84%
The Hive has a hull 242/4778 or 5% fuel 143/3200 4%
Turn 5 Now I have 2 Templar Defenders, 1 Explorer and 1 Hive ship in orbit. The display is the same as Turn 4 I just want to see
how much effect maintenance has on the ships.
a)Treasury is now $908 so I spent $23 in maintenance does this include the 9 for Cadar Prime?
After 1 turn of maintenance
Each Templar Defender now has a Hull of 108/152 or 71% and fuel 80/82 or 97%. In one turn the defenders repaired 4 pts hull, 13 in fuel.
The Explorer has a Hull of 92/92 100% and fuel 82/82 or 100%. In one turn the explorer received 15 in fuel
suggesting faster refueling rate and is 100% ready.
The Hive has a hull 242/4778 or 5% fuel 143/3200 4% The starting Hive ships appear to remain neutral. (By the way they cannot be demolished).
Turn 6 I demolished the 2 Templar Defenders, and Explorer. Moved the Hive ship out of orbit at the end of Turn 5. There have been
no changes in Population or completed projects.
Here are the screen snapshots for Cadar Prime Turn 6 and the Empire Summary Turn 6. The Mine is still under construction. Here are the results.
? a) My Treasury increased $736 is that because I got a refund on the demolished ships? If not how can I figure out where the money came from?
? b) I was expecting my Economy to return to 44. Why would demolishing three ships drop it to 33?
? c) I was expecting Income on the Empire Summary to return to 2, instead it is now 24 why is that?
? d) Once again I find myself confused by Colony $ 9/10. Cadar Prime does have a -9 $ maintenance but what does 10 mean, it makes more than $10 ? It also makes some sense that 90% is 9 of 10. How do I really explain this to myself? If it read 12/10 what would that mean?
? e) Is Colony $ = Amount your are spending in maintenance / Base cost of Colony maintenance? If that is true with a 20% discount I would expect to see 8/10 instead of 9/10 with a 80% maintenance rate on the Empire Summary. I have a morale of 10 what is happening?
Now I will just keep going until a significant event occurs like population growth, or mine completion.
Turn 7 No Change.
Turn 8 Cadar Prime completes a Mine, and increases population from 1 to 2. This will be the final round of testing.
Here are the screen snapshots for Cadar Prime Turn 8 and the Empire Summary for Turn 8
Questions Column:
? 1. Cadar Prime shows Spice as 5/2 but the Empire Status Screen shows Spice 1 why is that?
Only the Population has increased by 1 there have been no Spice Dens built why did Spice change from 5/1 to 5/2 on Cadar Prime?
? 2. CP = +2 for Starport. +2 Factories. +2 Cadar Bonus = 6 CP Total. There are no new upgrades under construction all CP are idle.
a) Why is Cadar Prime displaying +4 CP instead of +6 ?
b) Why is the Empire Summary displaying 3/0 for Busy/Idle when there are no CP being used for construction. And why doesn't it display 0/6.
? 3. Colony $ 9/15 with Maintenance Rate 60%. 9 of 15 is 60. Back in turn 5 we had a maintenance rate of 97%. It is interesting that
you can build more upgrades and at the same time lower your maintenance rate. How did this happen?
Cooking the books:
? 1. Why does the Cadar Prime display show $71 profit instead of $98?
? 2. Why does the Empire Summary display an Income of $24 which represents profit and how does it relate to an Economy of 33?
3. This thread sheds some light on the Economy but I feel short of applying it to what I think are optimal conditions.
Final thoughts: I had allot of confidence in teaching myself the answers to my questions.
In the end I generated more unanswered questions. The answers are on the screens the puzzlement is my own.
The numbers provided in the UI are there to help me play the game. I feel like the kid in the classroom who wants to raise his hand
but doesn't know the answer.
I started by reviewing and taking notes on the threads in the ST 4x forum. Next I used the Proboards search feature
to search for any threads that contained comments from Cory or Andrew and copy pasted them into my notes. Next I
copied all the descriptions from the in game library. I also played small games with multiple colonies to get a feel for the research tree
and politics. I still didn't quite understand how a colony really works. This thread is my attempt to find out.
This test is with a single Cadar colony without landing the other 2 hive ships. Why?
I want to isolate the inner workings from the huge political side and examine how the basic numbers work.
Here is the information I got from the Cadar Colony and Empire Summary screen shots.
The column marked ? indicates the questions numbered below.
| Turn 2. Difficulty Normal. Small Map. 1 Colony v1.0.13 |
| Cadar Prime | Empire Summary | ? |
| 17 Quality | 1/17 Quality | 1 |
| 5/1 Spice | 1 Spice | 2 |
| 0/3 Defense | 0 Defense | |
| 1/3 33% Population/Housing | 1/3 Population | |
| 1/17 5% Upgrades/Quality | 9/10 Colony $ | 3 |
| 1/2/1 Factories | 2 Factory | |
| 1/9 Mining/Mineral | 1/9 Mineral | |
| 10/10 Morale | 10 Avg Morale | |
| +33 Profit | 2 Income (Profit) | 4 |
| -9 Maintenance | 97% Maint Rate | 4 |
| 42 Income (Implied) | 44 Economy | 5 |
| 1,252 Treasury | 1,252 Treasury | |
| +3 CP | 0/2 Busy/Idle CP | 4 |
| +2 RP | 2 Research | |
| +0 EP | 2 Spy (EP) | |
| 0 Trade | ||
| 5 Ships | ||
| 33/33 Ship $ | 6 |
| Upgrades | ? | ||
| 1 | $10/Turn | Starport III +2 CP from 2 Population. Exploit 1 Minerals. +1 Research. | 4 |
| Ships | ? | ||
| 1 | $11/Turn | Templar Explorer Hull 92/92. Fuel 58/82. | 6 |
| 2 | $11/Turn | Templar Defender each with 100/152 Hull and 54/82 Fuel | 6 |
| 2 | $0/Turn | Colony Hive Ships Hull 242/4778. Fuel 144/3200. |
Questions Column:
? 1 . Cadar has a quality of 17. The Empire Summary displays 1/17. If a second colony had a quality of 10 would it read 2/27 ?
? 2. Cadar Spice 5/1 means 1 spice out of a maximum of 5 is being refined. What relationship does that have to current morale of 10?
We know that a Spice Festival will raise moral by +1 or +2 points. A Spice Den is described as "Entertain 5 Population" and each one
you build will subtract 1 from the total the colony has available. But what does that really mean? If you have a Spice Den, 5 of
the population must become unhappy before you lose a single morale point?
The Empire Summary shows the total empire wide units of Spice being refined why is that important? If the Average Empire Morale is low
knowing the total spice available could be more helpful. For example on the Empire Summary Spice 10/30 would be 10 refined 30 total.
? 3. On the Empire Summary: 9/10 Colony $. What is this, how does it relate to other statistics, why is it important?
? 4. Empire Summary shows a total of 2 factories have been built. We know each factory requires $10/Turn maintenance. When we
look at Cadar there is only 1 active. According to the Library each population unit = $14 Turn. Each Active factory = 1 CP.
Every CP not in use to build something = $10. The Starport generates 2 CP for 2 Population, does that mean it generates 1 for 1?
Cadar gets a +2 CP bonus. So here is the question:
| + $ 14 | For 1 Population |
| + $ 21 | For 1 Mineral |
| + $ 10 | For 1 idle factory |
| + $ 10 | For 1 CP Starport bonus |
| + $ 20 | For +2 CP Cadar Bonus |
| - $ 10 | Starport Maintenance |
| - $ 20 | For (2) Factory Maintenance |
| + $ 3 | 10% Discount on Maintenance |
| $ 48 | My calculated Profit |
a) 10% of 30 = 3. Is that why my Maintenance Rate is 97% in the Empire Status Screen?
Maintenance Discount was described as being 20% for colonies with morale equal to 10. Where am I going wrong?
b) Why does Cadar show a profit of +33 and maintenance of -9? Shouldn't that be +48 Profit and -27 for maintenance?
The Empire Summary displays Busy/Idle CP as 0/2 why is that not 0/3 to match Cadar Prime? There are no upgrades under construction.
? 5. Income and Profit. On the Empire Status I have a profit of $2. Cadar is showing a profit of $33.
The implied income of Cadar is the total of profit plus maintenance meaning the income for Cadar is $42.
The Economy displayed on the Empire Status is 44. How does this relate to Cadar and why are they $2 different?
? 6. Ships: Who is paying for them? I don't see where the money is being subtracted from. Does the 33/33 mean that
what it costs to maintain the ships followed by what I am actually paying? In turn 2 none of my ships are in green zone
orbit around Cadar Prime.
a) Am I only charged for maintenance when a ship is in a green zone not a red one?
b) Is the maintenance cost suspended once a ship is 100% fueled and repaired?
Turn 3 I performed no actions in turn 2 and simply tapped end turn to see what would happen.
The only thing that happened is my treasury increased $2 from $ 1,252 to $1,254 the rest of the displays remained unchanged.
I began to build a Mine. The Colony display changed immediately showing my treasury reduced to $954 from 1,254 and $24/-9 profit/maintenance
down from $ 33/-9.
a) Why did I only lose $9 (33-24 = 9) shouldn't that be a drop of $10 to reflect the 1 CP being used in the mine construction?
Nothing changed on the Empire Summary display.
(Mines build for 15 cp +$300 and cost $5 maintenance)
Now I brought the fleet into the green zone orbit of Cadar Prime and tapped end turn.
Turn 4 Now I have 2 Templar Defenders, 1 Explorer and 1 Hive ship in orbit. Cadar Prime's screen remains the same except the
Treasury is now $931 so something cost me $23 (954-931). However looking at the Empire Summary there is a big change;
a) How can three ships have a maintenance of $11 per turn and only increase ship $ by 14?
b) Does colony morale 10 apply a 20% maintenance discount to ships in orbit?
| 4 | Turn Empire Summary Changes |
| 47/33 | Ship $ (was 33/33) |
| 931 | Treasury (dropped $23) |
| -23 | Income (was +2) |
| 130% | Maintenance Rate (was 97%) |
| 3/0 | Busy/idle CP (building mine) |
The ships have been sitting idle in space and I want to get a handle on repair rates;
Each Templar Defender has a Hull of 104/152 or 68% and fuel 67/82 or 81%.
The Explorer has a Hull of 92/92 100% and fuel 69/82 or 84%
The Hive has a hull 242/4778 or 5% fuel 143/3200 4%
Turn 5 Now I have 2 Templar Defenders, 1 Explorer and 1 Hive ship in orbit. The display is the same as Turn 4 I just want to see
how much effect maintenance has on the ships.
a)Treasury is now $908 so I spent $23 in maintenance does this include the 9 for Cadar Prime?
After 1 turn of maintenance
Each Templar Defender now has a Hull of 108/152 or 71% and fuel 80/82 or 97%. In one turn the defenders repaired 4 pts hull, 13 in fuel.
The Explorer has a Hull of 92/92 100% and fuel 82/82 or 100%. In one turn the explorer received 15 in fuel
suggesting faster refueling rate and is 100% ready.
The Hive has a hull 242/4778 or 5% fuel 143/3200 4% The starting Hive ships appear to remain neutral. (By the way they cannot be demolished).
Turn 6 I demolished the 2 Templar Defenders, and Explorer. Moved the Hive ship out of orbit at the end of Turn 5. There have been
no changes in Population or completed projects.
Here are the screen snapshots for Cadar Prime Turn 6 and the Empire Summary Turn 6. The Mine is still under construction. Here are the results.
| 6 | Turn Empire Summary Changes |
| 0/0 | Ship $ |
| 1,644 | Treasury (was 908) |
| +24 | Income (was -23) |
| 90% | Maintenance Rate (was 130%) |
| 9/10 | Colony $ |
| 33 | Economy |
| 3/0 | Busy/idle CP (building mine) |
? a) My Treasury increased $736 is that because I got a refund on the demolished ships? If not how can I figure out where the money came from?
? b) I was expecting my Economy to return to 44. Why would demolishing three ships drop it to 33?
? c) I was expecting Income on the Empire Summary to return to 2, instead it is now 24 why is that?
? d) Once again I find myself confused by Colony $ 9/10. Cadar Prime does have a -9 $ maintenance but what does 10 mean, it makes more than $10 ? It also makes some sense that 90% is 9 of 10. How do I really explain this to myself? If it read 12/10 what would that mean?
? e) Is Colony $ = Amount your are spending in maintenance / Base cost of Colony maintenance? If that is true with a 20% discount I would expect to see 8/10 instead of 9/10 with a 80% maintenance rate on the Empire Summary. I have a morale of 10 what is happening?
Now I will just keep going until a significant event occurs like population growth, or mine completion.
Turn 7 No Change.
Turn 8 Cadar Prime completes a Mine, and increases population from 1 to 2. This will be the final round of testing.
Here are the screen snapshots for Cadar Prime Turn 8 and the Empire Summary for Turn 8
| Turn 8. Difficulty Normal. Small Map. 1 Colony v1.0.13 |
| Cadar Prime | Empire Summary | ? |
| 17 Quality | 1/17 Quality | |
| 5/2 Spice | 1 Spice | 1 |
| 0/3 Defense | 0 Defense | |
| 2/3 66% Population/Housing | 2/3 Population | |
| 2/17 11% Upgrades/Quality | 9/15 Colony $ | 3 |
| 2/2/2 Factories 100% | 2 Factory | |
| 2/9 Mining/Mineral | 2/9 Mineral | |
| 10/10 Morale | 10 Avg Morale | |
| +71 Profit | 24 Income (Profit) | |
| -13 Maintenance | 60% Maint Rate | 3 |
| 84 Income (Implied) | 33 Economy | |
| 1,692 Treasury | 1,692 Treasury | |
| +4 CP | 3/0 Busy/Idle CP | 2 |
| +2 RP | 2 Research | |
| +0 EP | 2 Spy (EP) | |
| 0 Trade | ||
| 2 Ships (Hives) | ||
| 0/0 Ship $ |
| Upgrades | ? | ||
| 1 | $10/Turn | Starport III +2 CP from 2 Population. Exploit 1 Minerals. +1 Research. | |
| 1 | $5/Turn | Mine 1. Exploit 1 Minerals. Equals +21 $ |
Questions Column:
? 1. Cadar Prime shows Spice as 5/2 but the Empire Status Screen shows Spice 1 why is that?
Only the Population has increased by 1 there have been no Spice Dens built why did Spice change from 5/1 to 5/2 on Cadar Prime?
? 2. CP = +2 for Starport. +2 Factories. +2 Cadar Bonus = 6 CP Total. There are no new upgrades under construction all CP are idle.
a) Why is Cadar Prime displaying +4 CP instead of +6 ?
b) Why is the Empire Summary displaying 3/0 for Busy/Idle when there are no CP being used for construction. And why doesn't it display 0/6.
? 3. Colony $ 9/15 with Maintenance Rate 60%. 9 of 15 is 60. Back in turn 5 we had a maintenance rate of 97%. It is interesting that
you can build more upgrades and at the same time lower your maintenance rate. How did this happen?
Cooking the books:
| $ | Cadar Prime Turn 8 |
| + $ 24 | For 2 Population |
| + $ 42 | For 2 Mineral |
| + $ 20 | For 2 idle factory |
| + $ 20 | For 2 CP Starport bonus |
| + $ 20 | For +2 CP Cadar Bonus |
| + $ 126 | Base Profit |
| - $ 10 | Starport Maintenance |
| - $ 20 | For (2) Factory Maintenance |
| - $ 5 | For 1 Mine Maintenance |
| - $ 35 | Base Maintenance |
| + $ 7 | 20% Maintenance Discount |
| $ 98 | My calculated Total Profit |
? 1. Why does the Cadar Prime display show $71 profit instead of $98?
? 2. Why does the Empire Summary display an Income of $24 which represents profit and how does it relate to an Economy of 33?
3. This thread sheds some light on the Economy but I feel short of applying it to what I think are optimal conditions.
Final thoughts: I had allot of confidence in teaching myself the answers to my questions.
In the end I generated more unanswered questions. The answers are on the screens the puzzlement is my own.
