|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Sept 26, 2014 19:09:25 GMT -5
I still have issues with treaties, wars and whatnot being replaced in less than 10 turns, but before I pester Cory and Andrew about it I wanted to know if anyone else has similar issues. In my case, this seems to happen somewhere around turn 300+. I'm over 400+ turns now, but I was over 20k in debt due to a long string of wars swapping out quite quickly (10 turns or less, some lasted only a turn!) before settling on one negative political event I could work at (even though I failed to scale a war down at least five times in a row. That was fun). I'm sinking again due to a single Solar War, but hopefully I used up all my bad luck.  So, anyone else having issues? |
|
|
|
Post by Cory Trese on Sept 26, 2014 19:32:05 GMT -5
Happens in my games too, definitely have to have treaties ready to go and a heavy focus on Colony balance with a careful management of morale, especially on higher difficulties.
|
|
|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Sept 26, 2014 20:59:24 GMT -5
Hmm. Just thought it was odd that it always seems to storm around 200 turns in (where you don't know what conflict will pop the next turn) before calming back down to a normal conflict rate somewhere at 350-400 turns. O.o I just thought that I might survey the boards and see what others think. Thanks for being the first, Cory!  |
|
|
|
Post by squee on Sept 26, 2014 22:54:59 GMT -5
Well, I haven't really noticed anything that bad... though I don't pay attention to politics that much.
|
|
|
|
Post by Cory Trese on Sept 27, 2014 11:37:17 GMT -5
I'm afraid the conflict generator doesn't look at the number of turns in the game.
|
|
vylox
Consul
Colonial Minister of Clan Javat.
Posts: 89 
|
Post by vylox on Oct 5, 2014 16:50:25 GMT -5
I haven't noticed anything based on the game turns, however I have noticed a trend based on moral. Plus another one based on colony balance between the factions.
Another thing that pushes the political conflicts around is closeness of factions to each other.
Also pay attention to the qualities. If you have a bunch of planets at close to their max quality, you will see more political actions changing.
Watch your spice trade and total quality. These seem to be very solid factors. Plus moral is HUGE.....
Though failing to cancel a trade embargo 15 times in a row is more demoralizing than anything else I have encountered so far.....(I mean really.... 75% chance of success....
|
|
|
|
Post by Cory Trese on Oct 5, 2014 16:56:24 GMT -5
I haven't noticed anything based on the game turns, however I have noticed a trend based on moral. Plus another one based on colony balance between the factions. Another thing that pushes the political conflicts around is closeness of factions to each other. Also pay attention to the qualities. If you have a bunch of planets at close to their max quality, you will see more political actions changing. Watch your spice trade and total quality. These seem to be very solid factors. Plus moral is HUGE..... Though failing to cancel a trade embargo 15 times in a row is more demoralizing than anything else I have encountered so far.....(I mean really.... 75% chance of success.... All very good points for maintaining a happy empire. Give each Faction a section of space, keep morale high, keep your Factions balanced. Failing 15 times in a row on a 75% chance ... long odds of that happening. |
|
|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Oct 5, 2014 18:10:47 GMT -5
You'd be shocked, Cory Trese. I've been spamming the Duel of Assassins treaty for the past 250-300 turns (no hyperbole- I'm badly in debt and have 40 spies working the treaty for 800 SP pts every time, so it takes 20 turns for it to go through, on top of knowing I always hit trouble around turn 200-250... I'm at 525 now...) and despite it having a "50%" chance of ending Solar Wars, I've only seen it end a Solar War twice or (I'm allowing myself some space for doubt as it really does take forever for the treaty to go through) maybe thrice since I fell into debt. So I'm hitting like 30%. D: Maybe ST4X politics simply hates me for some reason, but the odds most certainly are not in my favor... |
|
vylox
Consul
Colonial Minister of Clan Javat.
Posts: 89
|
Post by vylox on Oct 5, 2014 20:08:12 GMT -5
@ Cory Trese
Yes the odds are long, but it is relative to the rng itself. I did some testing for java and c++ randomizing and there end up being streaks inside of ranges. It is unusual but can happen. It was mostly annoying at the time because I had to keep reapplying it until it finally worked. It might have been a conjunction against the conflict generator too. Causing the measure to fail because a new embargo was to start on that same turn. Either way I am familiar enough with rng to not worry about freak anomalies happening.
The play I'm on that had this issue was finishing the treaty in 2 turns with EP to spare. So while it was annoying, it still didn't last too long.
@officer Genious
I would suggest looking at the overall structure of your empire. Something somewhere is causing an imbalance between your factions. Check your spice, your quality levels, and make sure that you have decent morale EVERYWHERE. These are highly important things. It could be as simple to fix and be able to ignore a solar war entirely by increasing the number of Palaces, Spice Dens/Halls, and exchanges. At the amount of turns you have played your colonies appear to be considerably out of balance. (No offense meant here). And unless you are playing as Steel Song, it might be more beneficial for you to focus on other treaties instead to change the status of the rest of your empire. Duels are not beneficial to your empire and I would rather let a Solar War continue.
Also using trade sanctions to end a war requires trade. No exchanges (or too few exchanges for that matter) means no trade, or not enough trade happening.
|
|
|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Oct 5, 2014 21:54:46 GMT -5
@ Cory Trese Yes the odds are long, but it is relative to the rng itself. I did some testing for java and c++ randomizing and there end up being streaks inside of ranges. It is unusual but can happen. It was mostly annoying at the time because I had to keep reapplying it until it finally worked. It might have been a conjunction against the conflict generator too. Causing the measure to fail because a new embargo was to start on that same turn. Either way I am familiar enough with rng to not worry about freak anomalies happening. The play I'm on that had this issue was finishing the treaty in 2 turns with EP to spare. So while it was annoying, it still didn't last too long. @officer Genious I would suggest looking at the overall structure of your empire. Something somewhere is causing an imbalance between your factions. Check your spice, your quality levels, and make sure that you have decent morale EVERYWHERE. These are highly important things. It could be as simple to fix and be able to ignore a solar war entirely by increasing the number of Palaces, Spice Dens/Halls, and exchanges. At the amount of turns you have played your colonies appear to be considerably out of balance. (No offense meant here). And unless you are playing as Steel Song, it might be more beneficial for you to focus on other treaties instead to change the status of the rest of your empire. Duels are not beneficial to your empire and I would rather let a Solar War continue. Also using trade sanctions to end a war requires trade. No exchanges (or too few exchanges for that matter) means no trade, or not enough trade happening. That sounds about accurate. No offense taken at all! I had some unfortunately bad rolls on two or three new planets in terms of quality and though I could still pull a living when the Trade War came (which is typically the bane of my empires' existences), I dropped very quickly from +1k a turn to -600 when a Solar War hit. As stopping Trade Wars comes quite late in the game, I didn't have much choice but to try to stop the Solar War instead. The first time it failed, I scraped just enough up to put it in again on my own paycheck. After that, it was just plain torture. Please understand, I love the game and I hate to be the crybaby of the forum board... Let me rephrase my posts then because I realize I often come across as whining rather than asking nicely (swallowing pride in 3... 2... 1...) On Hard, I tend to fall into a political pitfall of Trade Embargo/Trade War followed by Solar Wars that sink my empire to oblivion. I have asked before and built mines (which kept me afloat slightly longer than usual), but what is the best course of action to take when the planet ranges of 20+ decide to saddle you with three 8-12 quality planets around turn 250? How do you economically survive those kinds of bad rolls? I'd love to see how others handle it as I realize economics is clearly not what I excel at in here, heh. Officer Genious, not Chancellor Genious!! |
|
vylox
Consul
Colonial Minister of Clan Javat.
Posts: 89
|
Post by vylox on Oct 6, 2014 2:12:36 GMT -5
Getting those bad rolls happen, you just have to structure the planet accordingly. Around turn 200+ you should have access to things like Orbital mines, orbital platforms, and habitat 3. These can help ease the burden on quality and allow for more flexible building.
It seems to me that you might be neglecting politics in general.... I tend to never let a turn go by without some kind of treaty in progress from the moment they become available. If you skip a few turns in a row without any political action actively on your part, then bad politics will happen. And quickly.
Unless you are being very aggressive in colonizing, or happen to be engaged in conflict with the Xeno, you can keep a minimum of ships to help ease the burden on your economies.
I also tend to cluster the factions a little bit. Its fine if you have a couple places near each other, but having a few planets all in a group that is 1 faction tends to help reduce the amount of negative treaties popping up. (I am facing a string of negative treaties at the moment, but that's what I get for letting morale drop to 3 or lower on 18 of 30 colonies... it just isn't a big economic deal overall). Try to bring up your morale, and make efficient use of the space available. If you get bad planets, don't worry too much, you can sort of focus them. If they won't stop growing population, stop building houses! (There's another thread about population growth.. But this fits for both) you can let the morale of a lower value planet drop while you build that one the way you want to.
What kind of researchhave you completed ? How is your economy set up to begin with ? Can you afford to have planets sit idle ? Have you expanded too quickly at once ? (Sorry for the spam of questions!) Which are you using ? (Faction/House). How many of which do you have ? What kinds of planets do they all have ? (I always colonize red planets with Javat if I am playing them for example) How many and of what type of ships do you have ? Are they necessary ? If so are they all necessary ?
edit:
One of my best planets right now is 6 Quality 9 mineral. its got an exchange 3, starport 4, an orbital mine and 2x mine 3. with 2/3 population.
There are a myriad of factors that apply. And I am unsure as to how to help you. Just not enough information... Grasping at straws here ;>
|
|
|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Oct 6, 2014 7:52:33 GMT -5
Getting those bad rolls happen, you just have to structure the planet accordingly. Around turn 200+ you should have access to things like Orbital mines, orbital platforms, and habitat 3. These can help ease the burden on quality and allow for more flexible building. It seems to me that you might be neglecting politics in general.... I tend to never let a turn go by without some kind of treaty in progress from the moment they become available. If you skip a few turns in a row without any political action actively on your part, then bad politics will happen. And quickly. Unless you are being very aggressive in colonizing, or happen to be engaged in conflict with the Xeno, you can keep a minimum of ships to help ease the burden on your economies. I also tend to cluster the factions a little bit. Its fine if you have a couple places near each other, but having a few planets all in a group that is 1 faction tends to help reduce the amount of negative treaties popping up. (I am facing a string of negative treaties at the moment, but that's what I get for letting morale drop to 3 or lower on 18 of 30 colonies... it just isn't a big economic deal overall). Try to bring up your morale, and make efficient use of the space available. If you get bad planets, don't worry too much, you can sort of focus them. If they won't stop growing population, stop building houses! (There's another thread about population growth.. But this fits for both) you can let the morale of a lower value planet drop while you build that one the way you want to. What kind of researchhave you completed ? How is your economy set up to begin with ? Can you afford to have planets sit idle ? Have you expanded too quickly at once ? (Sorry for the spam of questions!) Which are you using ? (Faction/House). How many of which do you have ? What kinds of planets do they all have ? (I always colonize red planets with Javat if I am playing them for example) How many and of what type of ships do you have ? Are they necessary ? If so are they all necessary ? edit: One of my best planets right now is 6 Quality 9 mineral. its got an exchange 3, starport 4, an orbital mine and 2x mine 3. with 2/3 population. There are a myriad of factors that apply. And I am unsure as to how to help you. Just not enough information... Grasping at straws here ;> Hey, don't panic too much-- I'm not giving all that much info out in such an info-heavy game. XD Actually, another empire pretty much tanked after that Trade War, so I made (yet another) game. I'll start from the top this time, so let me set up another post and thread so it doesn't get too congested in here. If I can, I'll see about getting a place to host my screenshots as well at some point. |
|
|
|
Post by Officer Genious on Oct 6, 2014 20:39:33 GMT -5
Hey vylox, I made a thread in the Tips/Techniques section of ST Empires for a new playthrough of the Tutorial on Hard so you can see my thinking in detail. I'm not doing it turn-by-turn of course (no fun for anyone involved), but I'm trying to give a report of what I'm thinking and doing at major events/stepping stones in my empire's history (maybe every few new colonies, or major political events/issues in the empire?). Here's a link: Officer Genious's Hard Tutorial Playthrough |
|
|
|
Post by Paco on Jan 1, 2015 18:12:06 GMT -5
Don't want to necro an old thread, but justwanted to ask how much Treaties cost after the initial payment.
I "bought" several Treaties at once early on (year 3) and my economy tumbled from +300 to -800. (The three-way embargo isn't helping.)
Also, what' so bad about debt? I'm not too keen on paying up-front for my colony buildings AND waiting for them to get built, but other than that my army is still powerful and can shoot up Xeno ships forever (water only prevents Special abilities from being used) -- what's wrong with focusing on military, pinning Xeno's into the corner, and rapidly expanding everywhere else?
|
|
|
|
Post by Paco on Jan 1, 2015 18:15:24 GMT -5
|
|
