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Post by contributor on Jun 10, 2015 16:35:35 GMT -5
Since P2 is all about balance I'm curious to know if anyone else is having any luck with these classes? I have to say that haven't seen their genius just yet. My initial tries with a Hydra really didn't encourage me to keep up with him. I found everyone just ran right through his Napalm and then still need lots of shooting to kill, at one point I was even wondering if the fire was strengthening them, because they seemed stronger after going through it. I developed a Neptune a bit further, but I'm still having trouble seeing how he outshines a good soldier. My soldiers are all at least slightly higher levels so that could be one problem. Depending on how long P2 goes on, I will probably give them both a really solid try because I'm thinking that they just need more attention and leveling to be really brilliant. What is other's experience with them?
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Jun 10, 2015 16:43:20 GMT -5
I think the same thing. The flames seem to be a bit underwhelming when they are on the map, whereas flames in TA could outright kill a Xeno. However, I am loving the fact that the tiles you attack are lit on fire!
Neptune Troopers seem to be able to do more area damage than Soldiers at higher Talent Levels.
I suspect that we haven't gotten to their full potential yet.
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Post by jknut on Jun 10, 2015 16:46:15 GMT -5
Since they start so far behind, that has an impact. Also, if they aren't in your roster and get automatically recruited for the level, they don't have any talent upgrades for that map.
I think the Napalm should do a lot more damage if Xenos walk through and it should block Xeno movements or make them walk around it.
I would enjoy the game more if everyone leveled up together (whether they played the level or not). I would also prefer recruits to always come in at the same level as everyone else and the game difficulty to only impact other areas of the game. This would encourage more experimenting with different classes and talents. Per my previous post, I think Templars should be able to be permanently dismissed from the HQ and new ones recruited.
People might not want to start the game over if they feel they hosed someone's build.
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Post by fallen on Jun 10, 2015 16:55:36 GMT -5
Thanks for the feedback on the specialist classes. A couple of notes:
1) currently Hydra fire will not kill a xeno, only reduce to 1 HP. This is on our list to fix.
2) Dismissing Templars is on our list to add.
What Talents are you using for Hydra and Neptune? I find that the basic Hydra was very powerful and really good at holding retreats and keeping enemies away, especially when paired with a Soldier, pretty unstoppable.
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Post by slayernz on Jun 10, 2015 17:21:11 GMT -5
I wonder if the Xeno AI could be modified to actively avoid squares that are on fire. That's a natural instinct that all life forms seem to exhibit.  I have to finish my current tutorial run before I go into the boosted post-Tutorial team to try the Neptune and Hydra. In TA, I always found the Hydra to be "okay" ... you couldn't always guarantee a Xeno would be killed off. I'll be focusing a lot of energy into trying out the Neptune because that's my favorite specialist class. |
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Post by En1gma on Jun 10, 2015 17:36:22 GMT -5
I'm loving the Neptune. I have put his first talent up to three and he just shreds things. His OW is on par with the Soldier's, but his basic attack is what has made him shine for me.
Hydra seems -very slightly- underwhelming. It's awesome to just drop a 9-block of Napalm onto the battlefield. The thing is that only the initial attack does good damage- the residual effect seems really sad. Xeno don't seem to take as much damage as I expected. Keep in mind I never could get into TA, so I'm not sure what to really expect past that things die when exposed to napalm. I do agree that pairing them with a soldier is just the trick- I always keep a LL alongside my flamethrower.
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Post by fallen on Jun 10, 2015 17:47:00 GMT -5
The thing is that only the initial attack does good damage- the residual effect seems really sad. Xeno don't seem to take as much damage as I expected. I suspect the Hydra issue is 2 things. Xenos don't die (1 HP) and what you've mentioned above. Just like Sentry Turrets, the implementation for higher levels of the Talent are not in yet. The residual damage is the same and does not rise per Talent level, only the first blast. So, this will make a huge difference when a level 5 Napalm Charge can fry (and kill) everything coming through for a few turns guaranteed (excepting maybe Goliaths, Liches, Shields, etc) |
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Jun 10, 2015 17:48:38 GMT -5
Woah woah woah there fallen. What are Liches and Shields? |
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Post by ntsheep on Jun 10, 2015 18:35:13 GMT -5
Hydra + flames + Xeno = Roasted,  |
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Jun 10, 2015 19:14:36 GMT -5
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Post by contributor on Jun 11, 2015 11:26:58 GMT -5
I'm trying to figure out what is the point of Napalm Lance. It does exactly the same damage and everything as Hungry Flames but has no AoE and costs more Heat? What am I missing here?
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Post by Kanly on Jun 11, 2015 11:32:22 GMT -5
I was wondering about that too.
As a side note I've found that a hydra and a soldier make a great defensive team.
I'm not into the 2nd scenario yet so I can't speak to higher level requirements, but I've found neptunes to be a bit redundant with soldiers. Maybe a tutorial style intro to them would be nice.
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Post by fallen on Jun 11, 2015 11:41:56 GMT -5
I'm trying to figure out what is the point of Napalm Lance. It does exactly the same damage and everything as Hungry Flames but has no AoE and costs more Heat? What am I missing here? Sorry - our bad for not stating this before. They are exactly the same today. Napalm Lance is due for a fix that allows it to make a very long but thin cone of fire. |
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Post by anvil on Jun 11, 2015 22:25:16 GMT -5
I'm enjoying the specialist troops.
I got a hydra for my boost in game. At first I thought he was really not worth it for all the above reasons.
As I played I realized this is an alpha and he had potential. A sixpac of napalm and two shooters easily got rid of 4-6 skitters. I found that two hits from his primary one square weapon usually took care of business.
I can see that if the residual fires are tweaked, fire lanes can be created for better kill zones if backed with OW.
I created a Neptune in my latest hard squad along with a paladin. He is pretty kick ass with his 'squirt gun" a 3. I teamed him with the captain retrieving the three artifacts and he was pretty tough whilst doing about 2/3rds of this journey on his own and out of the captains gun range. The captain pretty much just kept the choke points open so he could get back without using firepower and blowing off heat.His heat needs watching. Having 3 OW, one with this full auto at 3 as a "floater" is pretty good defense.
So he is pretty versatile and prolly more so as he gets better.
A major change happened with the advent of 0.0.10. Using these specialists before made for some close games. The first money from the TP was ~$200+. It took enough turns to buy one that meant finishing under time limit was a gut wrenching challenge!
Now it ~$1000+, so its more relaxed timewise.
All in all even if this is off topic my favorite so far is the paladin. I'm building him as a strong med/fighter and having much fun. His healings are a limited number, but with proper timing I've sent the captain on a near suicide mission destroying a "wave" assault, then having the paladin heal him and playing him more normal the rest of the game. With this,,, timing is all.
The berserker is the tank. it takes a turn or so to get his defenses up,,, but then he's unstoppable.
And we are just at the beginning of exploring the tactical combinations and types of gameplay that can be done!
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