Mission Overdue Penalty

[bookworm21]

This is in the game right?

I haven't really noticed it taking effect, and as a result tend to take all the missions I can get, knowing that 'I'll get round to them some day'

Is this the intended game play? I feel like it would be nice to have to more closely pay attention to contract locations and deadlines

[Cory Trese]

It is in the game but it doesn't do enough. We will keep working on the balance for this.

[grävling]

Right now it's never worth cancelling a mission -- unless the mission itself is bugged somehow. But cancelling a mission seems a bit magic to me. If I can cancel a mission I no longer want to do, and that information gets back to my contact, why can't I just phone him up and say -- Ah, given that the solar war with Steel Song is now over, do you still want me to go assassinate those guys? Or are we all supposed to be friends now?

[Cory Trese]

Right, you cannot. Not in Star Traders RPG game world.

The only thing we're going to be working on here is the balance of the penalties in payment and rep.

I think they should be more severe. That's the part of this thread I'm going to be focused on.

[John Robinson]

May 5, 2017 17:52:30 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

Right, you cannot. Not in Star Traders RPG game world.

The only thing we're going to be working on here is the balance of the penalties in payment and rep.

I think they should be more severe. That's the part of this thread I'm going to be focused on.

Cory Trese
< Live from Lilliputian's corner to doctor Gulliver>

Carrot not the Stick?	Give a significant bonus cash and +rep for completing a mission early.
	Player will have more motivation to take long range missions.  Contact's own influence in the faction should get a bonus too for early completions.  Especially on hurt my enemy / help my friend missions.    It's too easy to become myopic and reach first for a penalty to influence game play.  I think it's more fun to reward than to punish when shaping game play.
Tied to Game difficulty?	You want to play on a tougher level?  Ok you got it.  The higher level you play
	the bigger the rep / influence / cash penalties for late missions.
	Lower difficulty levels help out players already cash strapped trying to
	learn how to become a better player.  Becoming an ST2 master should
	be a progression of difficulty levels that impact mission penalties.
Rep & Influence Loss	The contact needs you too.  After the early game phase, they aren't the only
	game in town anymore, and better wise up.  You might even start working
	for the contact's enemies.  If I ran 10 perfect missions for a contact and then
	take a big hit on one late mission?  I'd be pissed and start looking elsewhere.
	What next?  I'm late couple times and my rep goes to zero?
Tough Cash penalty?	Valid reasons for being late abound.  I'm on a long range mission for the contact.
	Get mauled by pirates and zenos.  Suddenly cash strapped.  I've got to take
	some local contracts to build up enough cash to complete my contract with you.
	Even though it was tougher to complete your mission than cancel it.  My loyalty
	to the contact made me go through hell to complete the contract.
	Should I skip meeting a new nearby contact because baby might get cranky?
	Are contacts so naive they can't understand or tolerate late missions?
	Should penalties be mitigated based on distance and danger?
	Repeating myself:  More carrots fewer sticks.

[grävling]

I think that part of the problem is that many of the missions are timed such that there is very little margin for doing other things while you are on a mission. Just deciding to take a load of crop harvesters to a faction Farming world you are about to visit on a mission can add enough time that the mission will end up late. I think there should be a significant cash advantage to doing missions that come with such tight time limits, because you are paying in lost opportunities.

But I also think that some missions are the sort that could be planned well in advance, and thus a contact could be presenting them as opportunities with significantly longer time for completion. They won't have the 'tight-timing' bonus -- but they might well prove to be more fun to do, as you will not have to convert your operation into being the chief dogsbody of your local Prince contact. These are the sort of missions favoured by Merchants and Smugglers who have a regular trade route to run, but are willing to supplement their trade income with a little mail/cargo/passenger/prisoner delivery, as long as it is on the way. It might be a good deal for the contacts involved, as well, as they can save money and maybe even influence this way.

[Officer Genious]

I agree. As a smuggler I routinely am late because I live for good trades. If you want me to do more missions on time, offer a good incentive.

[Cory Trese]

That's interesting. Most players are not having problems with trading while doing missions.

On-time percentage with concurrent play actions is the norm in the game data right now.

Perhaps we'll consider extending some of the timelines for certain mission types in the future.

However, we know that right now things are pretty close -- 92% right now and I think we're aiming for something around 90%

So, right on target with concurrent action set data analysis only.

The only thing we're going to be working on here is the balance of the penalties in payment and rep.

I think they should be more severe. That's the part of this thread I'm going to be focused on.

[grävling]

I think that if most players are getting their missions done on time then they must have very, very few concurrent missions (except for the starter-period, all in this quadrant sorts of missions which don't count). And I find doing missions one or at most two at a time to be almost entirely without fun -- the fun for me is in the logistics, and there isn't any logistics if you just 'go to where you were told. return. take another mission. repeat.'

[bobc]

Would it be possible to include / detail any late completion penalties in the mission summary screen when you are disscussing things with your contact?  For any penalty to be effective we need to fully understand how and why we are being penalised.  That way you have the option to manage your route to avoid penalties, or minimise them if it seems worth picking up some extra missions or good trades on the way.  It would also be good to see what penalties were applied as part of the post-mission completion / payment dialogue.

[MintDragon]

bobc that is very interesting. Time critical vs less time critical.

Agree with Cory Trese, it really is a balancing thing. Amount of penalty, etc... But is would be a great to know that a certain mission is your 'priority', and needs to be accomplished (or else). Right now there isn't a compelling reason to not pick up more missions, even if they can't be accomplished on time.

And, the only time I've received a long deadline was when the target planet was quarantined. Seems like a giveaway. Might be nice to have more variety in deadlines, perhaps a low-risk, low-payoff mission. But you can do it anytime over the next 2 years.

[xdesperado]

Cory Trese I heartily agree with what John Robinson posted.
Seems like there are a ton of ways already in game to easily lose lots and lots of rep while methods to gain rep tend to be time intensive, much more difficult to do and often aren't able to generate enough positive rep to counter the sorts of negative rep hits your likely to take.

Game doesn't need even harsher penalties in regards to rep with factions and contacts, instead it needs to offer more attractive alternatives to gaining decent amounts of rep.
This becomes particularly important when contacts have a number of goods/services that are locked by your rep with them.
If I have to turn into the personal lacky of one contact for prolonged period of time to take advantage of what they have to offer they start losing some of the appeal and fun, if I get slammed with to harsh of penalties from a late completion where my rep gets tanked that becomes even more of a no fun situation.

While I don't expect gaining lots of rep to be very easy even on lowest difficulty I also don't want it to be near impossible to build solid relations good rep on the highest difficulties either.

[athios]

Bonus pay for Rush/Urgent missions.

Immediately cut 20% pay on missing a deadline. Further cut based on length of delay (scaled to original allowed time), e.g. additional 5% cut for each {20% of original duration} overdue.

Example
Stated pay: $10,000
Original deadline: 20 weeks {20% of this is 4 weeks}
You took: 28 weeks
Actual Pay = 10k * (1 - 0.2 - 0.05 * 2) = 7k

How does that sound? It's a penalty, but not terribly severe. Even if you took double the allowed time, you'd still get 55% pay. Not sure if the system tracks enough info to make this work this way though.

[grävling]

I also think it would be fun if some missions required you to have a small fast ship, or else you would not arrive in time.

[Officer Genious]

May 6, 2017 23:34:49 GMT -5 grävling said:

I also think it would be fun if some missions required you to have a small fast ship, or else you would not arrive in time.

I don't think I would like having some missions effectively unavailable to me because of my ship.