Early 2 handed maces

[CdrPlatypus]

Im looking at the early 2 handed maces you can get and they seem underwhelming compared to there one handed candidates. The best one hander you can get in osk has a min of 90dmg/turn and a max of 120 where as the best two hander has a min of 58dmg/turn and a max of 122. Hardly seems worth giving up the ability to hold a shield and being limited to two attacks rather than 3. Especiallly with the new phalanx shield upgrades.

[Cory Trese]

2 Handed Hammers forever!

[CdrPlatypus]

I love the sound effect and the big swing, but without some love the math just isn't in their favour

[fallen]

CdrPlatypus - I've checked the math and the 2H Hammers fit the equations perfect and chart out exactly as they should. Sounds like they just aren't for you and your group's build at that stage. Always an option later.

[Cory Trese]

I like 2H hammers because they reduce SP cost by 50%

[algesan]

Aug 13, 2014 23:33:21 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

I like 2H hammers because they reduce SP cost by 50%

You know, you could have pointed that out earlier.  It does depend, heavily, on the build, especially since Vraes is more than capable of being a consistent damage dealer and tank without burning mana on base attacks on most of the more optimum early builds.  For those, 2h weapons are usually a waste.

[fallen]

algesan - pointed it out earlier?

[Cory Trese]

I'll be honest, I never use any of the no-SP base attacks. I've probably played complete games without using them once.

I have seen videos of people tanking with Vraes where he uses Strike and just soaks damage with Buffs instead of killing stuff with Savage, but that is too slow for me.

Different styles for different players =)

[CdrPlatypus]

I guess it does come down to individual style; for me as cool as the 2 handed hammers look and sound they just aren't attractive enough for me to give up the utility of a shield and 2ap attack early on.

[En1gma]

Remember also that higher base damage can mean less total armor soaked, leading to higher damage output per hit. If your 2ap mace does 30 damage per swing, with armor soaking 15 damage at lowest, you get ~45 damage given dice etc. A 3ap mace doing 45 damage against the same armor (15) you get ~60 damage after soak. (Correct me if my math is off here) So the trade off ends up being that you get much higher damage, and therefore bypass more armor soak overall. But this only matters if you consistently connect. Missing once with a 3ap drops you down to 50% max damage output, whereas missing once with a 2ap only drops you down to 66% (not counting soak)

[fallen]

There was a huge thread on this at some point, and many argued the case for 2H weapons. I love them myself, for the reasons listed by En1gma and Cory Trese

[CdrPlatypus]

I have read the thread. with -armour/resist and +dmg and increased chance to crit you can do more dmg per turn with a lower ap weapon, but it is more sp inefficent. But you only really need the big hits on big things like mr troll IMHO.

[crimsonshadow]

It's probably ill advised to go against the game creators... But what the heck... I say long live the 1AP Dex based blades!!!

[Cory Trese]

Aug 14, 2014 23:12:00 GMT -5 crimsonshadow said:

It's probably ill advised to go against the game creators... But what the heck... I say long live the 1AP Dex based blades!!!

I agree, but only for characters with talents that are tuned and balanced for 1AP weapons. Characters like Vraes do very, very poorly in mid to late game with a 1AP weapon.

[fallen]

Aug 14, 2014 23:11:50 GMT -5 CdrPlatypus said:

I have read the thread. with -armour/resist and +dmg and increased chance to crit you can do more dmg per turn with a lower ap weapon, but it is more sp inefficent. But you only really need the big hits on big things like mr troll IMHO.

That said, my current group is using all 1 AP and 2 AP weapons

All depends on the build!