Give immolation +crit

[Kanly]

I love Kj, so much so that I almost never use vincent. I always miss CA too much. After CA I typically go into BB and then split that with either FB or FS.

I've tried IM in the past, but it always seems lackluster compared to KJs other spells, even with the up balancing it has received. It lacks the range and aoe pattern of FS and can't be cast 3 times like FB can. When cast twice, it is more expensive than either FBx3 or FSx1. Once again, IM is not a bad talent, but to me it is just less attractive.

I suggest adding +crit to IM to give KJ another interesting build option. It would sync really well with BB. A crit build IM KJ would be loads of fun!

[fallen]

Thanks for the suggestion! And for your support I will take a look, but when we did the up-balance, the math looked solid.

EDIT: it is possible too much weight is being assigned to the fact that it is a 9-box AoE.

[slayernz]

Yeah I'm with Kanly in that Immolation seemed a bit weak. Yes it was AOE, but it didn't cause enough damage and cost so much. In early stages of the game, KJ and Tami used to go toe to toe trying to vie for most kills, but in higher levels, Tami just laughs and KJ is relegated to campfire duty.

[Vraesrial]

I agree, as well. After a while, I just re-speced into Firestorm. Immolation never really had the AP-Damage ratio I was looking for. Infact, I'd say the same for several other abilities, too. Try and give us more of an incentive to use these!

[En1gma]

I didn't have anything to do with this one, I swear.

How about + crit vulnerability? Something that actually makes use of its 9 box and turns it onto an asset instead of a limitation... If it were to doink armor or lower Dodge to an extent, I think it would be far more utilitarian, and serve a better purpose than just AoE...

My two cents tho, there'll probably be more in the future

Free Immolation!!!

[En1gma]

And what? There was an up balance-- for Immolation?

[xdesperado]

How about Immolation giving additional -Armor say 1 point per level, or maybe a -resistance to fire?
Would still need to hit and do damage with initial attack but would help entire party and any subsequent attacks by Kjartan.

[slayernz]

Burn over time ? Fire damage affects 1, 2, or 3 turns in a row (depending on level) - kinda like Hydra fire

[En1gma]

Yesssssssss, rekindle the Immolation debate, muahahaha!

The flames of change can never be extinguished, it is useless to resist... Unless you're the one who actually codes the thing, then fine...

[John Robinson]

High level Immolation was improved in version 3.2.17.  I like all the other suggestions.  But all critical hit percent stacks,
being able to add Burning Blades(10) +36 Fire Damage, +6% Critical, 8+Conjure turns, and +Crit to Immolation seems to me a little off balance.

[wascalwywabbit]

We may see a change thru gear if nothing else...

[Cory Trese]

Mar 10, 2016 19:40:10 GMT -5 John Robinson said:

High level Immolation was improved in version 3.2.17.  I like all the other suggestions.  But all critical hit percent stacks,
being able to add Burning Blades(10) +36 Fire Damage, +6% Critical, 8+Conjure turns, and +Crit to Immolation seems to me a little off balance.

Well put. And you can always stack your gear to match your Talent / Buff / Curse build.

[En1gma]

Can we give KJ Promethium?

Would be 100% the coolest thing that could happen to Immolation-- lasting flames like what a Hydra puts out...

"Engine can't support this" incoming in 3...2...

(Hey, a guy can dream, can't he?)

[Rashar]

There is nothing wrong with immolation to be honest, firestorm is just so much better.

Immolation becomes good once it reaches the 3x3, the biggest difference is in the AP cost because a double immolation cast can be really strong but then ofcourse the SP becomes the issue. And most people that play Kjartan also use CA10 and/or MSxx so it's not like he can cast a double immolation all the time either and CA perfectly combines with Firestorm for a total of 7 action points.

I do have to agree that there is no real reason to invest points in immolation, if you want aoe then firestorm 5 is all you need.

If I am to suggest a way as to make immolation more competitive I would not persay make it do something different but I would personally lower the AP cost from 3 to 2 and then also lower the spell damage and sp accordingly. Although the SP cost has to be higher then firebolt so that spell does not lose it's effect. Although with an aoe ability for Kjartan that will cost 2 I think firebolt will then lose any value it has.

[Kanly]

Mar 10, 2016 19:40:10 GMT -5 John Robinson said:

High level Immolation was improved in version 3.2.17.  I like all the other suggestions.  But all critical hit percent stacks,
being able to add Burning Blades(10) +36 Fire Damage, +6% Critical, 8+Conjure turns, and +Crit to Immolation seems to me a little off balance.

The problem with that argument is twofold: 
1. It takes a lot of talents and gear to build KJ that way, diminishing his investment in other talents. 
2. You can make that argument with any other talent. Take Vincent for example, with EotS can easily garner 20 crit from talents alone. Tam in my top level group is sitting over 50% crit.  V can easily top 50% as well. For KJ, other than 6% from BB, any other crit has to come from gear. Adding a few points of crit would hardly break his character.

It isn't a terrible talent. It has a lot of potential, but it gets outshined by other talents by a good margin. FS has a range and targeting advantage, FB does more focused damage and is more SP efficient.

Vincent's ES is a good bit cheaper, does more damage, and leaves a lasting debuff that the whole group can focus on. I know the range is shorter, and that you have to take the character as whole before you compare individual talents, but ES is the closest comparison for me.

There's just nothing about the talent that jumps out to me that makes me want to build KJ around it, like a FS or FB build. It's fine, just not interesting to me as it is.