Looking for an awesome basic 4 build

[lux]

I got a new phone, and I haven't yet figured out how to transfer the saved games off of my old one, which is completely dead (any tips or suggestions?), so for the moment, I'm restarting HoS from the beginning. Since I've only got the basic four (Vraes, Kjartan, Kyera, Tamilin) and don't want to switch yet, I was wondering what you all might suggest as a kick-ass build for the default party. I had been using this (suggested by the Trese Brothers themselves on the Steam HoS discussion board):

    1) Vraes - build him for 2H combat. Raise Stone Skin, Crushing Blow and Burst of Speed.
    2) Kjartan - use him as an Ash-Wizard, raising Choking Ash. Hit -everyone- with it. Also, raise Pureflame Shield and Burning Blades as secondaries.
    3) Kyera - get her to Healing 3, then start pumping Ethereal Anguish. Hit everyone with it. From there, you'll have to pick between more buffs, better healing or starting to use ranged          attacks. Get at least one point of Sacrifice by the time you finish Episode 1.
    4) Tamilin - raise Aimed Shot to 2 or 3. Get Dance of Shadows to 2 for the +1 MP, and then start raising your Deadly Intuition. Put this as high as you can go, and give Tamilin the         best Crit % gear you can get. Don't raise Aimed Shot again, and wait out for Level 18 Ranged Onslaught.

But it's over a year and a half old. So what do you all suggest as interesting party builds given the more recent game updates (2H strength damage change, Inferno, Ethereal Anguish, and other changes, etc.)?

[wascalwywabbit]

The thing I would change is BR for dmg for Vraes instead of CB. Making sure to get a good balance of his tank talents to you're liking. With NM you could get good acc from ssw 1 and a 1h blade if you want lvl 1 phalanx for the ranged autoblock. BR has a nice uptick and using less sp per attack allows other buffs to use the sp instead.

When Juggernaut is available you may consider that for your empowered attack once BR and denfenses are adequate.

The next thing is whether you want to add ToS... Bringing it to at least 3 wedge and/or -2ap takes pressure off of EA allowing better support or dmg by Kyera, but the original recommended is still quite strong too, so that's more a toss up imo. Kjartan is probably the same, but maybe add immolation enough to hit after everything is cursed with ash. 1pt. FS is always nice for large mobs, ashing primary target first for acc.

My 2cents.

[crimsonking]

I'd rather go for Dogde/Parry/Weapon Defense on Vraes instead of Stoneskin. Armor and Resistance fade in efficiency compared to Dodge and Parry, so Phalanx Shield and Natural Mastery would be the talents to look for. I'd also use Juggernaut as attack. Also I usually don't pimp weapon attacks too much since most of the damage comes from the weapon used. The exception are those talents that have great secondary effects.
Vraes: Phalanx Shield 10, Burst of Speed 10, Juggernaut 10, Natural Mastery 10 with CB 1 as fallback attack
Kjartan: Ash 10, Burning Blades 10, Firebolt 10, Immolation 10
Kyera: EA 10, Warder's 10, Retribution 10, Banishment 10, do healing via potions
Tamilin: Blacknight 10, Deadly Intuition 10, Torrent 8, Ranged Onslaught 9, some points in Stalker

[lux]

Thank you both! Not sure which of your builds to go with, they both seem fun and interesting.

Some questions:
- Why Immolation instead of FS?
- Why not balance Stoneskin and NM or PS or both?
-Crimsonking, in your build,what do you use for Vraes for damage before access to Juggernaut? Just CB 1? Or do you respec at some point? And why no BR?
- Doesn't healing with lotions get expensive? Are Banishment and Holy Retribution worth it in the end? (I'm guessing so, since you recommend them, I'm just curious about the logic.

[bookworm21]

Immolation had that sweet sweet +crit vulnerability, and can be cast twice a turn.

As to Kyera's banishment and HR, I assume it's because in the city of the dead (E3) there is a lot of weak-to-holy-damage monsters - not that I've made it there yet though.

Wrt stoneskin mixing with NM or PS, I tend towards the dodge/parry route and ignore SS, as the attack either hits you or it doesn't - going in half-and-half ive found underwhelming as Vraes can barely block or take hits! I don't take the two-handed approach normally though, so your mileage may vary.

[lux]

Also, a corollary question: do you have any particular recommendations for attribute and skill distribution? I mean, obviously you want to distribute to support your build, but for instance with a parry/dodge-focused Vraes, does it become worthwhile to put points into dexterity to boost that at the cost of accuracy/damage (or whatever) from his strength-using weapons? Or with Tamilin doing bows and a bit of ToS, what's a good balance distribution balance between thrown/bows and security/stealth? Etc.

[bookworm21]

SECURITY IS USELESS unless you want a chance of auto-disarming a trap Tam steps on. It has no other purpose.

One day I will try a stealth built sneak slot, but I haven't yet, and thus never put points in stealth. If I was going to, I'd add points (don't forget gear and buffs as well ) until I was happy with the proportion of suprises gained. Hopefully others with more experience with this style and the game in general can chip in; I believe CdrPlatypus recommended ?19 stealth for E2? (That was probably nightmare ironman though )


For a party/dodge vraes I personally didn't put any points into Dex, relying on PS + parry/dodge buff from healer. On hard difficulty, he was excellent in melee but often had to rely on autoblock% to stop ranged attack.

He was wearing -Evasion (strong def against ranged) heavy armour though.

If you struggle with arrows, investing in Dex may be worthwhile, as dodge stat = 75% of your Dex, and non-spell based ranged attacks use Dex as std def dice as well. If it's just melee you have concerns with, I'd probably stick to a shield and use gear with +parry especially.

If you aren't using a shield, then it's probably a harder decision to make.


As always, ymmv as this is just my experience with my current parties

[crimsonking]

Sept 12, 2016 16:14:57 GMT -5 lux said:

Thank you both! Not sure which of your builds to go with, they both seem fun and interesting.

Some questions:
- Why Immolation instead of FS?
- Why not balance Stoneskin and NM or PS or both?
-Crimsonking, in your build,what do you use for Vraes for damage before access to Juggernaut? Just CB 1? Or do you respec at some point? And why no BR?
- Doesn't healing with lotions get expensive? Are Baishment and Holy Retribution worth it in the end? (I'm guessing so, since you recommend them, I'm just curious about the logic.

1. Immolation can be used twice per turn and debuffs targets. In pure DPT the low AP talents are often stronger, and this one has a debuff on top. The only downside is that it has lower range and target number potential, but both can be mitigated.
2. Stoneskin and armor in general are cleary weaker than Dodge, Parry and Weapon Skills. You won't have enough armor and resistance to soak considerable amounts of damage from high damage enemies, especially bosses, ever. Not getting hit is the far better option and should be the primary goal of frontline builds
3. Vraes will always deal some damage as long as he holds a good weapon in his hand. I always use single target physical damage melee talents on level 1 because the amount of damage added through higher talent levels is far lower than the damage added by good weapons except early on, and buffs/debuffs are not only more effective, but also cheaper in the long run. There are potential reasons to raise weapon talents, like adding more targets and better buffs/debuffs, but damage and accuracy alone aren't worth it
4. Healing with potions isn't expensive since you will find plenty. I rarely have the need to buy one

[bookworm21]

Potions I find I have to be fairly sparing with at first but by the siege of red hill I have so many I can start using em a lot more. Especially as you start to find more group-heal and group-spirit potions - great for a little boost to get you through a combat so you can camp with minimal expenditure.

Also a dodge parry party should be taking less damage in the first place

[CdrPlatypus]

The og 4 are set up for critical now so my suggestions would be to go phalanx shield, bos, berserk rage, juggernaut

KJ choking ash, immolation, burning blades, later episode 3 /4 meteoric Shockwave

Kieran is the hardest to decide how to build, I would suggest for the beginning of the game to grab sacrifice, warders shield, max out hammer or pole arms for defense EA is lower on my list these days, eventually 6 is useful, also consider banishment. Long story short general support, then work on damage starting in episode 2

Tam Max out blades first for defense and bring torrent of steel up to at least 3, black night to 2 then DI work on DI to 10 use a mix of Rex and con