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Post by eyeleveleye on Nov 6, 2016 21:18:53 GMT -5
I've been playing HoS off and on for over a year now and finally left a 5 star review. I felt a little resistance giving it 5 starts because I do not find the game perfect, but regardless of my minor criticisms, I felt that I have enjoyed the game 5 stars worth and recognize the fantastic work the Trese Bros have done to make this game a reality. I wanted to leave the following random observations about the game here for consideration of both the devs and the players. Feel free to tell me I'm wrong on these points, but please also tell me why.
Items:
There are a variety of cool items throughout the game but I find very little reason to purchase anything from a shop in later 3 & 4 episodes except for group stamina potions. It really has been the only thing I have spent my money on in both of those later episodes. Other items like weapons and armor don't seem to be as good as what I already have. Is this an oversight I wonder?
Tactics:
Just wanted to share my top 2 tactics with nearly every battle (except boss fights where they don't work at all). I'm curious if others agree or have better tactics to share. I suspect this depends on the party makeup and skill focuses. I have been using the original core characters all the way through.
1) Find a one or two square choke point and block it with your melee fighters with your ranged fighters behind them (sometimes as much as 2 squares away from front line to avoid enemy AoE).
2) If you don't have immediate access to such a choke point, be willing to flee back in the direction you came for as many turns necessary until you find one. In my experience, all enemies will fail to kill you if you run away and rally.
Finally, I find the following thing very strange:
I have Vraes maxed out in Strength, Constitution and Polearms with max Crushing Blow. While he is a fantastic meat wall I use to absorb damage for the team, he is my weakest fighter with the best pole arm I have found so far (Keen Glaive 81 - 158 Dmg, 4% crit, +4 SP Drain). He misses more than any of my other characters and he consistently deals the lowest damage of any other character. I would expect that Vraes would be able to deal a great deal of damage in melee especially considering his archetype and the fact that he is using a pole arm which only affords him one attack per round. The pole arm path seems like it should be more devastating than it is, or at least offer some sort of threatening range ability to target enemies 1 square away. As it is, I suspect I may have selected to specialize in a weapon path that has broken mechanics in the game, or one that at least does not recognize the benefits of a pole arm. For me, a maxed out Vraes with the best pole arm I can find is a disappointment in melee combat. I suspect that is not the developers intention?
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Post by mandomaniac on Nov 6, 2016 21:36:42 GMT -5
Great post  Vraes can be a huge damage dealer, (he was for me in my now lost Amazon ep4 group) I personally prefer swords to polearms but close enough for this. A lot of vraes damage imo comes from BR, also adding NM can add to accuracy, I thundering blades is a must for the damage and straight up accuracy boost, I also use 1h weapons so that I hv 3 hits per round. |
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Post by fallen on Nov 6, 2016 21:37:24 GMT -5
eyeleveleye - thanks for the 5 star and for the post! Welcome to the forum, hope you'll stick around. There is a big crew of Heroes veterans active here. On the items -- when you say stamina potions, I guess you mean Health Tinctures (+HP for all). What a great item. I find I buy a lot of other types of items, including +SP for All, and I always keep a solid stash of Tomes for Dispel to get rid of enemy curses fast, and Sustainment for upping Buffs in long fights. If you are retreating a lot to choke points, then you'll find your long fights might run those Buffs out. for I'm curious what difficulty you are playing on? On weapons and armor, there are lots of opportunities in the game to get to a shop that is selling much higher level gear than you have likely found in the dungeon. Also, gear in the shops has better coverage of types, so if you've found a great Shield but haven't found a great Spear, then when a new shop opens up, be sure to go checking. There is definitely a strategy and some practice to hitting up the right shops at the right time in the game. Shops rarely change the gear they are selling, so if you go to a shop "late" (i.e. too high level, been in higher level dungeons) then you may find shops on the boring side. I know the Hermit in Bone Pass and the Armor Shop in Granthorn are always of great interest to me as I enter Episode 2, not to mention that I can almost always stop by the shops in Riven Field and pick up new armaments that trump what I have for at least 1 or 2 characters. Since shops are mundane items, of course, it can be hard to trade off your magical gear for a weapon with higher base stats, but sometimes it can be worth it. Also, there are some really amazing staves and shields out there, if you know where to go shopping. Sounds like a very valid strategy of falling back to a chokepoint. Just safe, defensive fighting. Personally, all of my teams are built to rush. I push forward into the enemy spawn immediately as to get the best clumps for my AoEs and curse heavily. That is my favorite. I would say I fall back less than 5% of the time, only when I things are really nasty. I love the aggressive style. You should give it a try -- the game plays faster too. Sounds like you found a very underwhelming weapon for Vraes. Also, if you've selected Crushing Blow as his main Talent, then you'll need to assist him with other characters. The game is about team building, so expecting Vraes to be the best he can be on his own is always going to fall short. Crushing Blow is an especially tough one, since you're reporting that you aren't hitting. And Crushing Blow has the worst accuracy. So, sounds like your first start is to find a weapon with better accuracy, or to buff your accuracy gear, or to raise Natural Mastery high. Or to use a Curse that reduces Dodge and Parry. So many ways to go about it, but once you've identified something that isn't working, there are lots of changes you can make to improve! Once you start hitting more, maybe you'll be happier!
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Post by wascalwywabbit on Nov 6, 2016 23:00:01 GMT -5
Hey friend, since you're using the og 4 team... Vraes NM (natural mastery), with NM +weapons and +acc (and new + str in dmg sense!) and Kjartan's CA (choking ash), with CA -parry and -dodge, will be your best talents to aid CB (crushing blow) acc. Kyera's EA (ethereal anguish) and Tam's ToS (torrent of steel) will also be potential boons to whole team acc on anything cursed by them. Both curse enemy dodge and ap, so both improve team acc and defenses in a similar, and somewhat compounded way. For dmg, BR and NM combine greatly for Vraes. The 2nd team of heroes have even more acc and dmg boons to explore when you get time to play them.  |
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Post by eyeleveleye on Nov 6, 2016 23:10:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the input guys. It sounds like I just chose the wrong path for Vraes and need to respec him with one of your build recipes. It's too bad though. I like the idea of him having a pole arm (he even has one in his portrait I just didn't know the right recipe to make him effective with it. I have actually completely neglected ranking up and using Beserk Rage and Natural Mastery. I just figured I could make him a competent fighter by focusing on "always on" stats and using Crushing Blow or Ferocity. The only buff I really ranked and use for him is Stone Skin. I'll have to ditch the pole arm and use some crystals to respec him for the second time. I must have got lucky and cooked up the other 3 characters with a nice combination of ingredients because they kick ass all over the place. Right now I use Vreas to draw enemy attacks and block their movement because he can take it all, but that's about the extent of his usefulness in the group (albeit an important role still). > when you say stamina potions, I guess you mean Health Tinctures (+HP for all). I misspoke. I actually meant Spirit potions. Not Stamina potions. I never buy Health/Healing potions. Just "Spirit to all team members" potions. I play my cleric as support and heal with her first before using her for combat. She keeps everyone top health every turn, and sometimes has enough AP left to still attack. I may use an occasional healing potion once in a while, but only ones I find. I find them unnecessary for the most part as long as I can keep spirit up with the Spirit potions. > I always keep a solid stash of Tomes for Dispel to get rid of enemy curses fast Yeah, those are good and I have used those on occasion, but I have found enough of those so haven't had to buy them yet. Maybe I would have to use more on higher difficulty level? I am playing on Easy. I think I also have been heavily relying on the Clerics Purifying Breeze to dispel curses too though. > If you are retreating a lot to choke points, then you'll find your long fights might run those Buffs out. Yeah that's a possibility, but realize I tried to create a party that wouldn't have to rely on a lot of buffs. The only two buffs I really use is Stoneskin for Vraes and Pureflame Shield from Kjartan. And they're cheap enough to recast while the enemy is trying to close ground with you after you ran away. Though I am now getting that in order to make Vraes effective, I really need to use other buffs for him. > There is definitely a strategy and some practice to hitting up the right shops at the right time in the game. Shops rarely change the gear they are selling, so if you go to a shop "late" (i.e. too high level, been in higher level dungeons) then you may find shops on the boring side. Yeah, chances are that's what happened. > I push forward into the enemy spawn immediately as to get the best clumps for my AoEs and curse heavily. Yes it seems there are a lot of valid way to play styles that work with this game which is great. |
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Post by fallen on Nov 6, 2016 23:32:49 GMT -5
eyeleveleye - sorry if I gave the wrong impression on spears. They are great weapons, and some of the more accurate in the bunch and they have a narrower band of damage which can help make your damage more consistent rather than pinging. Ignoring Vraes' Buffs, especially Natural Mastery, is a mistake. At least one level in Natural Mastery is required, its so cheap for the bonuses it gives you! Definitely, the Tomes can be be replaced by Talents, but that costs a lot of AP. I think on higher difficulties you'd find you'd have more situations where you want (need?) to use a Tome to get things straightened out with 1 AP. If you are not using Buffs ... you should! The best team will mix empowered attacks, a heavy dose of curses and buffs. I think you will find that they are a major multiplier on your force and effectiveness. To cast them fast, be sure to use Auto-Buff button!
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Post by wascalwywabbit on Nov 7, 2016 0:00:07 GMT -5
The differences between melee weapons are not truly great...
Max dmg, at the expense of parry, hammers, especially considering str bonuses.
Reliable dmg with some better parry and maybe less str reliance, spears or swords.
Wanna dual wield? - swords.
The greater difference weapons wise is in to 2 hand weapon it, or 1h with shield, and str v dex. Offense, acc and dmg, 2h usually wins for Vraes (depending on build); 1h w/shield wins defensively, and possibly offensively in 1ap cases (light blades) with lots of magical and mundane dmg buffs and curses on enemies.
The tactical games I played before didn't need curses and buffs to be most effective in the same way HoS does. Running without much buffs or abilities to curse enemies will really hamstring your potential team synergy.
Always have a team acc buff, or enemy dodge curse at least, preferably -parry too running melee fighter(s). Choose some team defense buff, maybe 2 or 3. Usually at least 1 or 2 ap curses for most builds ... though -acc curses and +dodge/parry buffs, or dmg curses + hp/armor buffs and heals works too depending on area and difficulty.
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Post by tay on Nov 9, 2016 12:13:52 GMT -5
Running a spear wielding vraes at the moment. Wasn't sure if it was working out but once I got NM up to a decent level he started dishing out good consistent damage. Along with the odd 1000+ damage critical. Which I can't remember doing before in 4 previous runs. (Pointy)Stick with it....
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Post by fallen on Nov 9, 2016 12:33:07 GMT -5
tay - nice hits! Natural Mastery, especially with the new Str-Damage bonuses, is such a key Vraes Talent!
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Post by crimsonking on Nov 9, 2016 16:05:50 GMT -5
The best way to add melee accuracy and damage is not to raise the attack skill but to raise attack and damage buffs as well as armor, resistance, dodge and parry debuffs.
Berserk Rage and some offensive buff from Kjartan/Vincent/Fyona will help you far more than getting CB to 10. CB 10 only adds +5 Accuracy and an average of 45 damage. Berserk Rage adds an average of 23 damage and lots of crits on every attack. Accuracy comes from Talents like Thundering Blades or Choking Ash.
When planning my parties, I prioritize the following way:
* durable effects (buffs and debuffs) before attack talents for weapon attacks, since raising attack talents often raises SP cost more that it raises the talent's efficiency
* buffs before debuffs, since buffs always work while debuffs only work for debuffed enemies, and buffs are cast before battle
* group buffs before single target buffs, since the bang for the buck is higher in the sum
The one big exception for that is Elemental Sundering since the added damage is ridiculously high especially when combined with Holy Strickening and you'll much of your invested SP back on a hit.
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Post by Ewill on Nov 13, 2016 9:12:16 GMT -5
My vraes almost never misses because I've been threw that issue before with crushing blow. And I don't use any accuracy buffs. I make sure his equipment has plus Merle ace on it and I go juggernaut like a beast also natural mastery. Crushing blow is not a good main attack choice imo. Loving juggernaut
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