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Post by havnor on Apr 4, 2017 23:25:21 GMT -5
This was going to be a major section, Brutus. Hydra are undeniably one of the most important Templars on higher difficulties. But also you need protection on higher levels and something to take down single strong enemy which can't be taken in one round. Best is headshot scout for one round solution, or using crippling fire or suppressing fire for denieng AP/MP ( but this is mostly melee solution, but hellsight rifle? [that one with 8range, relic] can be used for ranged crippling). If you are melee orientated you can try to dish out massive single dmg of hammer paladin or curse attack of berserker, but mostly it is important to have at least one shieldbearer in front to try mitigate as much dmg possible. Best for me is berserker with shield or paladin because of buffs and gear with evasion. Let the captain use debuffs and both at least one single lvl Aoe attack it is worth it. |
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Post by bobc on Apr 5, 2017 3:49:01 GMT -5
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Post by En1gma on Apr 5, 2017 6:01:30 GMT -5
Added both, Templars.
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Post by En1gma on Apr 5, 2017 10:56:13 GMT -5
In-Depth Section (In Progress (Soldier))
Soldier: The Universal Warrior.
The Soldier is easily one of the most, if not THE most important Templar in your roster.
Weaknesses of the Soldier: There are no real weaknesses to this Unit, save for a lack of melee defense.
Strengths for the Soldier:
--EXTREME Flexibility. There are three weapon classes available to the Soldier, brutal short-range Plasma Rifles, powerful mid-range Heavy Rifles, and accurate extended-range Long Rifles. They are also capable of wielding the venerable Concussion Grenades, fantastic devices capable of disabling enemy Movement and Dodge.
--Overwatch Support. Possibly the most important ability available to the Soldier, Overwatch is intended to cover lanes of approach and remove threats before they can reach your Battleforce. Soldiers are one of three units capable of providing this vital ability, but the Soldier does it best-- All other units capable of OW support (Engineer's Turret and Neptune) either require investment in certain talents (Engineer) or are better suited for other aspects of their build (Neptunes are capable of OW support, but it could be argued that their Talent points are better spent elsewhere). Soldiers can also Overwatch right out of the box, so to speak, and are vital to every deployment in the game.
--Buff Support. The Soldier possesses some of the most potent Offensive buffs in the game, particularly Rallying Charge (provides Damage and Movement Points) and Calling Shots (provides Ranged Accuracy and increases chances to score a Critical Hit). They also possess a powerful defensive buff in Defensive Stand (eventually provides Auto-Block, Parry, Dodge, and Armor bonuses).
Most Useful Talents: Overwatch, used to slow the enemy advance and cover spawn points. Rallying Charge, used to keep your Battleforce on the move and hitting hard. Next to OW, this is IMO the most important talent for the Soldier, possibly most important in the ENTIRE GAME.
Least Useful Talents: Lockdown; for some builds this could be useful, but it is better to not allow enemies within striking distance. Defensive Stand; there are simply better talents to focus on, and while this could be used, Talent Points are better spent elsewhere. Grapple; unless you need extra melee defense in a pinch, don't bother. I'm not going to list Grapple for every class so I'll just say it here: Unless you are building a Templar to use Grapple (which I would advise against), don't touch this talent unless you have VERY good reason.
How to use the Soldier: Often, and with intent. Soldiers are vital to your Battleforce because of the support they provide with both OW and buff Talents. Soldiers are best deployed and paired with the Captain or other melee competent Templars such as the Paladin or Berserks. Overwatch will either kill outright or severely weaken possible combatants, leaving them vulnerable to melee strikes or counterattack from the front lines. Rallying Charge should ALWAYS be employed when moving from one objective to another, and it is often worth keeping your Rallying Soldier below his/her Heat threshold, just in case it needs to be applied in an emergency.
Overwatch should be used to cover lanes of approach, especially against the Fog of War where you cannot see Xeno threats before they come through and rip you to shreds. It is highly advisable to utilize Sensorkit Scans with either your Scouts or Engineers to push back the Fog to reveal lurking threats, which can then be covered by OW.
**POST IN PROGRESS**
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Zhivago
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Post by Zhivago on Apr 5, 2017 12:23:49 GMT -5
Ironman player here with my best team currently entering Hive Mind with zero deaths. While specific squad tactics, buildouts, and requisition distribution are important, I'd like to stress the importance of a couple of more general and sometimes overlooked aspects of consistently strong high difficulty runs in BF. First: Your Templars' greatest strength lies in their ability to draw upon the experience of their ancestors. These posts detailing what to expect, tactics, and even recorded playthroughs are the equivalent of our Templar 'ancestors'. Use them! Learn from their victories and mistakes, know what your enemies behaviors and tendencies are. My run is a culmination of the experiences I read about and studied here. Second: Slow down. Consider the consequences of your movement and actions before committing to them. We all know mistakes on harder difficulties of TB games are often fatal, but what you might not realize is the accumulation of suboptimal movements and actions (not mistakes, per se, but decisions that could have been better) steadily increase the chance that your enemies will overwhelm you. I tend to actively consider at least two turns in making decisions regarding Templar movements/placement/actions. That consideration includes what my best guess is of the Xeno's actions during that same span. We tend to do that automatically/unconsciously to a large extent as veteran gamers, but since the consequences on higher difficulty levels are so severe (Permadeath!), conscious or active pauses to ask the question "Why am I making this decision?" can be the difference between success and failure. Third: Embrace the heat! Managing heat is certainly an important part of BF, but that doesn't mean you should strive to be in the green. Your Templars are conditioned to operate at their best even in the midst of a firestorm, and if you're not consistently pushing the heat redline on higher difficulties, then you're likely not optimizing your movements/actions. As En1gma continues to flesh out this very helpful tactics thread, I'll chime in with more specific squad strategy, buildouts, and requisition distribution as necessary. Just as an aside though, my team's only Hydra was the one I got during Extermination Protocol and I've invested zero RP into their tree.  Basically, the Trese Bros have done a great job in balancing to ensure there's multiple ways to skin those Xeno! |
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Post by En1gma on Apr 5, 2017 12:36:11 GMT -5
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Post by havnor on Apr 5, 2017 15:05:15 GMT -5
I would like to add from my point of view engineer is vital part of the team, often you need to use then and so you should have synergy with their build with rest of the team...for example no turrent if you use soldiers and neptunes, but yes if you have berserkers...engineers May look weak but with new flamethrower and debuff which add fire dmg they can be godlike company to few hydras...
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Post by En1gma on Apr 5, 2017 15:45:41 GMT -5
Will be part of the Engineer breakdown, thanks!
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Post by contributor on Apr 5, 2017 17:59:30 GMT -5
A few more general comments. A would second Zhivago's comment on embracing the heat. I've seen some people on videos playing as if you shouldn't be above the green ever. You'll never survive if you play that way. Within that area though, it's important to be able to time your heat build up vis-a-vis the objective. If you know how many turns you have left you can really use heat wisely. The best is finishing a level with 2 or 3 templars just shutting down due to heat. Also piggy-backing on the idea of slowing down is the idea of knowing where all your knights will end their turn before you do anything. Because of the MP/AP dynamics of BF you always have to move first and then use your AP including buffs. I illustrate that pretty well in the video below. That makes me think of the idea that it would be cool to have some short videos that demonstrate various tactics, rather than having long videos that play through a whole level. Anyways, on the topic of movement this is a very important concept for making ironmaning possible. If you don't move then buff/fire your wasting incredible resources. Also movement can be very key in the placement of OW zones. Many times, at the start of a turn, you can feel completely surrounded and overrun. But judiciously pulling the whole team in one direction focusing on killing only a few xenos and then placing OW zones so that the horde now has to march through them can really change the dynamics of a battle. I guess the concept is to recenter the battle. It can be tempting to just stand and start throwing grenades but you've got to maintain something of a front. On the front idea, I've never been able to get away from the need to have a frontline melee tank. This is normally my captain. Eventually the xeno will get too close for comfort and if you don't have somebody who can stand toe-to-toe with them you're going to get hurt quick. That's all I have for now, I should start playing again in order to really be able to contribute. |
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Apr 5, 2017 18:13:19 GMT -5
I agree. Heat is fine when built up over 100%. The Templars, especially ones with higher Willpower, can easily withstand a few Heat burns here and there. It's only past 150% that I would begine to even worry too much about it.
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Post by bobc on Apr 6, 2017 2:41:07 GMT -5
Heat is a big consideration, especially as you move up in difficulty because the ability to dissipate heat gets reduced. At lower levels it is easy to run 6+ MP and stay green, at higher levels moving in shorter jumps and using armour that has -MP can be part of a heat management strategy.
There are also Talents that are affected by heat. If your strategy is to run hot then do you want to spend points on Buffs that are heat limited?
On longer missions you might want to identify "safe areas" where you can pause for a couple of turns to bleed heat and re-buff ready for the next objective.
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Post by havnor on Apr 6, 2017 5:22:41 GMT -5
You can also manage your heat with engineer...However he will build up heat very fast so probably using relic reactor for him (+MP+60 heat)...
However, with combination of pressing need, or rallying charge and so on, you should also deploy as much as needed of specialist be it two hydras in extermination by fire or two engineers when you need multiple tp's...This goes with breaking your squad in small teams or individuals so besides using group buff for some mission it's better to use for example berserkers (with one of best selfbuffs and also selfheals) connected with engineer/hydras/scouts... Many tíme you can achieve victory by running objectives very fast... However you can sometimes use brute force of bigger Battleforce (+6) and then it is better to focus on group buffs and class synergies...But for some levels I find builds without defense (soldier,Neptune, turrents) much better...usually with group around 4 templars because you can't defend effectively you need to cull through xenos in way and absorb or avoid others...
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on Apr 6, 2017 6:45:59 GMT -5
Another thing that Soldiers are great at is the fighting advance. When you need to fight through a wave of Xeno to reach the objective on the other side, Soldiers can make an attack that hits 1-5 enemies with Burst Fire, chuck a grenade into the fray, then set down Overwatch to keep the remaining horde at bay.
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Post by havnor on Apr 6, 2017 9:27:19 GMT -5
Another thing that Soldiers are great at is the fighting advance. When you need to fight through a wave of Xeno to reach the objective on the other side, Soldiers can make an attack that hits 1-5 enemies with Burst Fire, chuck a grenade into the fray, then set down Overwatch to keep the remaining horde at bay. For me for this task is grenade,plasma,shredding fire,lockdown soldiers... And chaplain, Relliars fists... Also dragoon Armor relic... I would say godlike build for advance for me at least |
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Post by En1gma on Apr 6, 2017 10:12:28 GMT -5
I almost never use Plasma Soldiers... Their damage is amazing to be sure, but their damn awful range is what keeps them off my roster. I find that the Heavy Levs are more than sufficient to punch holes in almost any Xeno, but have enough range to keep them away. I will certainly include them as a viable build for the purposes of this thread, but I'm just not a fan. Low difficulties they are OP as hell, but on Brutal and up, I'm uncomfortable letting enemies get that close to something without a counter-attack.
I used to use them in the Alpha as a Captain/Engineer escort, and still do once in a while, but their close-in tree takes RP away from my broader strategy. Shredding Fire/Grenade/-MP Armor works very well for them and if you use Rallying Charge they can keep up no problem.
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Basically, the Trese Bros have done a great job in balancing to ensure there's multiple ways to skin those Xeno!
