New Combat Stuff

[Ahab]

Gravling, I believe you are wrong about the relative benefits of dodge armor vs. ballistic armor. I believe you are missing the fact that armor Dodge values affect Defense, which in turn affects Soak. So a high Dodge value on armor helps both Defense and Soak. If you calculate it out, the Kraken Suit actually has a higher Soak value (7 plus your Brawling or Dexterity skill) value than Jaguar Armor (3 plus your Brawling or 6 plus your Dexterity), in addition to having a higher Defense. So the Kraken Suit is the best nano-ready armor for both avoiding hits and for diminishing hits that you don't avoid.

In fact, it turns out that you always want high Dodge armor instead of high Ballistic armor. If you can't afford nano-ready armor (or are playing at Normal difficulty and don't need nano-ready armor), then the best armor is either the StealthTekk Vest or the Infiltrator Suit, depending on whether you are more worried about brawling or ranged attacks. And both these armors are only 6075 Nuyen. These armors have even better Defense and Soak than the Kraken Suit--the only thing the Kraken Suit has over them is being nano-ready.

Cori, I doubt that this domination of dodge armor over ballistic armor is intentional. It may indicate a problem in the formulas or armor values. If you really intend the two most expensive armors (I believe the Battle NanoSuit and Jaguar NanoGuard) to have any benefit over the cheaper Kraken Suit, then either the armor Dodge value should not be included in the Soak calculation, or the Ballistic and Deflection values on some armors need to be increased to offset the negative Dodge values.

[nemesis]

May 24, 2012 18:20:44 GMT -5 Ahab said:

Gravling, I believe you are wrong about the relative benefits of dodge armor vs. ballistic armor. I believe you are missing the fact that armor Dodge values affect Defense, which in turn affects Soak. So a high Dodge value on armor helps both Defense and Soak. If you calculate it out, the Kraken Suit actually has a higher Soak value (7 plus your Brawling or Dexterity skill) value than Jaguar Armor (3 plus your Brawling or 6 plus your Dexterity), in addition to having a higher Defense. So the Kraken Suit is the best nano-ready armor for both avoiding hits and for diminishing hits that you don't avoid.

In fact, it turns out that you always want high Dodge armor instead of high Ballistic armor. If you can't afford nano-ready armor (or are playing at Normal difficulty and don't need nano-ready armor), then the best armor is either the StealthTekk Vest or the Infiltrator Suit, depending on whether you are more worried about brawling or ranged attacks. And both these armors are only 6075 Nuyen. These armors have even better Defense and Soak than the Kraken Suit--the only thing the Kraken Suit has over them is being nano-ready.

Cori, I doubt that this domination of dodge armor over ballistic armor is intentional. It may indicate a problem in the formulas or armor values. If you really intend the two most expensive armors (I believe the Battle NanoSuit and Jaguar NanoGuard) to have any benefit over the cheaper Kraken Suit, then either the armor Dodge value should not be included in the Soak calculation, or the Ballistic and Deflection values on some armors need to be increased to offset the negative Dodge values.

My thoughts exactly. Most nano ready armor have negative dodge bonus and are not hard, so it affects soak ability. With the armors set up this way, when nano ability goes online, The Kraken Suit will rule.

When that happens all I can say is this:

RELEASE THE KRAKEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

;D

[Cory Trese]

Truth is I could test and worry about these big updates indefinitely.

There has to be a point where I just bite my fingers and push the button.

[nemesis]

@cory

Just push the button and let us sort through all the bugs ;D If it doesn't work then we will tell you and the other sock puppets, so the errors can be fixed and everything can run smoothly later on

[grävling]

Well, the new armour is protecting the ganger punks some from Tasers. So I often have to hit them more than once. I assume this is intentional, though wasn't discussed, so I thought I would report it anyway.

Dogs apparantly do not wear armour, and I would have expected the heavily augmented ones to have some sort of dermal armour. Or maybe dermal armour doesn't work well against tasers -- I haven't tried shooting a dog, after all.

Nice release Cory, I am liking it a great deal.

[Ahab]

May 24, 2012 22:38:55 GMT -5 Cory Trese said:

Truth is I could test and worry about these big updates indefinitely.

There has to be a point where I just bite my fingers and push the button.

Sure thing. You said to "Discuss", so I discussed. ;D

Now, let's see how this sucker works...

[fallen]

grävling - thanks for the feedback. Its the foundation on which we can keep building a more diverse system for weapons, enemies, and tactics. Glad that you are liking it! We will keep working on refining now!

[Cory Trese]

May 24, 2012 15:27:33 GMT -5 grävling said:

One of the confusing things is that there are two things called 'dodge' in this game. One is the passive sort that you do all the time, and which the dodge bonus or penalty on your armour effects. The other is the button 'dodge' which is an action you can do when in combat and reacting to an attack.

I think that it would be a good idea to change one of them -- and the button would be easier -- to 'Evade' so it is clear that they are two different things. I started out believing that the dodge bonus on your armour was related to how well you dodged in combat when you pressed the button -- and since I rarely did that, didn't discover that a high dodge value was a good thing to have until many months after I started playing this game.

Now, which dodge are you talking about here? I think that it makes good sense for the dodge button in combat to be related to your agility, thus to your dexterity, and also your perception skill.

But as for your armour -- Did you ever read the book _Singularity Sky_ by Charles Stross? In it Rachael Mansour has combat armour that she has to exercise in -- but which is a lot faster and more accurate than she would be naturally. This is sort of what I think of when I think of an Agent DX suit and its ilk. I.e. the suit is actually doing the dodging for you, detecting things with it's sensors and reacting.

If it isn't 'dodge bonus' but 'camouflage bonus' that the suit is providing -- then I strongly recommend renaming it. Then making it 's effectiveness dependent on your stealth ability -- if your ability is poor you won't be able to use it effectively makes a lot of sense. But I think that in this case there should be nanowear you can purchase that makes a nano aware camouflague suit do an even better job that what you can buy in the store. And maybe even illegal versions that have an even better version.

This would make the suit more like the 'Darksuits' used by the Official burglars in Walter Jon Williams trilogy about Maijstral the Lord and Burglar -- minus the anti-gravity that let's you fly in them, of course. I would find that a lot of fun.

Evade is a much better name. Then the suits help with Evasion.

Instead of worrying about some complex sliding scale of max bonus I just nerf'd them a little.

[nemesis]

The armor makes opponents more challenging since they are harder to kill. I like it as well I also noticed that dodge armors got slightly nerfed by 1 point in dodge bonus and the prices went down a bit. Seems like a good compromise so far. Can't wait for nano to work properly so I can release THE KRAKEN

[Cory Trese]

May 26, 2012 0:10:43 GMT -5 nemesis said:

The armor makes opponents more challenging since they are harder to kill. I like it as well I also noticed that dodge armors got slightly nerfed by 1 point in dodge bonus and the prices went down a bit. Seems like a good compromise so far. Can't wait for nano to work properly so I can release THE KRAKEN

Nano works great. So does hardening. You get a toast when it kicks in.

[nemesis]

Wait... It works now with savior medkits? What exactly does nano do beside medkit assistance and what is toast?

French mebbe Seriously though, I have no idea

[Cory Trese]

If you are have "Nano-Ready" armor and carry at least one Savior(TM) you are auto-healed if your HP is reduced to zero.

Basically, the armor can use the nanobiotics in the medkit automatically if it detects that your are dying.

[nemesis]

Wearing my Kraken Suits now What is toast though?

[Cory Trese]

"Nano Medkit Consumed."

[nemesis]

Sweet! Will let you know if my runners croak. Have 25 of the saviors on standby for this hehehe