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Post by Cory Trese on Jul 27, 2013 2:46:41 GMT -5
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Post by grävling on Jul 27, 2013 2:56:19 GMT -5
Thank you. Hurry Up Google Play!
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moody
Exemplar
Posts: 298
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Post by moody on Jul 27, 2013 3:02:04 GMT -5
War v's Typos. Love it  It's a hearts and mind thing. |
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Post by grävling on Jul 27, 2013 3:22:52 GMT -5
War v's Typos. Love it It's a hearts and mind thing. Isn't there a way to get all the dialogs from Nathanial Sveet's quests as a file somewhere? I think the war would go faster this way. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2013 3:51:17 GMT -5
Wasn't v0.3.3 just released?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 27, 2013 3:53:44 GMT -5
War v's Typos. Love it It's a hearts and mind thing. Isn't there a way to get all the dialogs from Nathanial Sveet's quests as a file somewhere? I think the war would go faster this way. Yeah and put it through spell checker. Or you can give it to gravling. He's like a human spell checker himself. I mean, have you ever seen gravling make a typo? I mean ever? |
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Post by grävling on Jul 27, 2013 7:42:13 GMT -5
Cory I _love_ the new wind info text. But can you change 'in irons' to 'beating to windward' (or just 'beating' if space is at a premium) 'in Irons' implies that you are stopped dead in the water, not moving, or even moving backwards, which isn't what you mean here. see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacking_%28sailing%29Also 'in irons' implies (I think, have to check this one) a fore-and-aft rig. But most of the ships in this game are square-rigged. I'm not sure a square-rigged ship can be in irons. Another thing to check. Another thing to check is whether many (any?) square rigged ships could sail close-hauled at all. Many, I know could not, and thus had to beat to windward whenever they wanted to sail closer than a beam reach. |
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Post by Cory Trese on Jul 27, 2013 12:39:36 GMT -5
Cory I _love_ the new wind info text. But can you change 'in irons' to 'beating to windward' (or just 'beating' if space is at a premium) 'in Irons' implies that you are stopped dead in the water, not moving, or even moving backwards, which isn't what you mean here. see: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tacking_%28sailing%29Also 'in irons' implies (I think, have to check this one) a fore-and-aft rig. But most of the ships in this game are square-rigged. I'm not sure a square-rigged ship can be in irons. Another thing to check. Another thing to check is whether many (any?) square rigged ships could sail close-hauled at all. Many, I know could not, and thus had to beat to windward whenever they wanted to sail closer than a beam reach. More research here shows you're spot on. 'In Irons' is the wrong terminology. Also, I do understand the challenges square rigged ships faced close-hauled, but I'm not sure what to do. I don't think we can tell a player 'you cannot go that way' but I am thinking about a connection between the Tack Ratings and the penalties for beam reach to beating windward. |
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Post by grävling on Jul 27, 2013 14:50:42 GMT -5
Idea: 1. change 'in irons' to 'beating to windward'. 2. if the ship is rigged fore-and-aft, allow them to sail close hauled. 3. if the ship is squared rigged, write 'beating to windward' instead of close hauled for those bearings, as well. 4. charge them time and damage penalties whenever they are beating. The 'in irons ' sort could cost more than the 'close hauled sort'. 5. think long and hard before introducing brigantines into the game. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brigantine(but, hey, won't the art for them be fun to draw?! :-) ) |
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Post by grävling on Jul 27, 2013 17:41:09 GMT -5
Also what we have now is a ship's description:
'Running Great'
'Tacking Good'
This conflates 4 issues. The first is How Fast is She.
Square rigged ships, as a rule of thumb, are fastest when the wind is somewhere between running and broad reach. They can sail at a beam reach, or can run. Closer to the wind is impossible for them, so they must bear (tack) and thus are very slow when they need to travel in this direction. Fore-and-aft Rigged ships, again as a general rule, will be fastest at a beam reach. They will be able to sail close hauled, and some of them are excellent at it. Thus they can escape heaveir square rigged enemies by sailing closer to the wind -- they will not need to tack while their enemy must, so it does not matter that in some sense the square rigged ship is faster in absolute terms comparing its best to the fore and aft's best.
The second is 'how close to the wind can she sail' and we have already gone into this.
and the third is 'given that you are tacking, how quickly can you come about'? i.e. stop zigging and start zagging. Can you keep any of your momentum from one tack and take it to the next one?
Square rigged ships have a much harder time at this. This is what the huge number of men in the crew were for. But with training, they can become quick at this. And, unless you have a catastrophe -- like having your sails catch fire in the middle of an attempt to come about --
square rigged ships have a sort of 'worst case' -- beyond which we cannot get any slower. Fore and Aft rigged ships have to wait for the wind to fill their sails on the other side before they can properly come about. Should they miss their stays, and not come about, they will end up in irons, and stop dead in the water. So -- in general fore and aft rigged ships are much better at this, but when they screw up they end up far, far worse than their square rigged counterparts.
This last is more a matter of training than anything else, but you can simply be unfortunate and get an gust of wind from an unexpected direction at precisely the wrong time, and even the best trained crews can flounder.
Finally there is the matter of what sails the captain chooses to use, and how he chooses to rig them. There was constant controversy over what was best, and some ships did very well in rigs that ought not to have worked nearly so well for them, while not performing very well with rigs that ought to have worked out better. Captains would scratch their heads and experiment more trying to find the best possible layout for their finicky charges.
It would be nice if captains sailing skill and crews general ability all made a difference in how well one sails around here. :-)
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Post by Cory Trese on Jul 27, 2013 19:01:50 GMT -5
Already the Crew skill and Captain's Navigation and Sailing come into play heavily in terms of safety and speed to travel. You cannot yet see or celebrate Crew skill, but soon.
I like your commentary and find it to be well considered and good reading for the designer of AoP.
The map turns in AoP are intended to simulate between 4 and 24 hours of sailing which intends to aggregate and normalize some of the complexity of minute to minute sail management.
The map direction in AoP is intended to show gross direction of travel, not necessarily an accurate heading (otherwise, you would need to be able to sail NNW, etc)
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Post by Cory Trese on Jul 28, 2013 23:47:12 GMT -5
Now on the amazon.
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It's a hearts and mind thing.