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Post by gearheadwhat on Jun 25, 2011 17:31:56 GMT -5
Awesome work man! Is that just the ships from Free, or does it include Elite? My favorite elite ship so far is the Royal Class. I forget all it's base stats, but here is what mine had IIRC (the character with 3 of them died last night) Hull 22 Armor 11 Crew 70? 40 Engines 40 Solar Sails 100 Hold 36 Guns 10 torpedoes I think I had these upgrades: Extended gun decks +7 guns Prow gun batteries +5 Water Tank Leviathan System Omni Stealth Array. Factoring that in, the thing started with 28 Guns. Either way I loved the ship. Same animation as the Smaller Jango class (As opposed to the same image with a longer 'neck'). Hard to find anything with better all around everything. Good for combat, prospecting, trade. Fairly much anything really  I died in a shuttle though going to move one from one drydock to another though... I was sad. @ Cory: Is there a reason the coordinates in the game don't align with standard x,y axis? That is: Why is the further 'down' you go become more positive? Shouldn't 'down' become a negative Y coordinate? Just curious. I notice the things made here use normal x,y labeling, but the game doesn't, so we just have to invert the +/- of the y axis to get where it is. Visually it's perfect though. Freeking amazing work  Just curious like I said. I'm okay with it, but it took me a while to get used to it. |
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 25, 2011 19:21:57 GMT -5
Make one for understanding the female species and you shall live like a god. ha i could make one that slowly gets bigger over time and keeps asking why you don't click on it anymore |
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 25, 2011 19:33:39 GMT -5
thanks for all the positive feedback! it was a lot of fun to make and use.
i def want to get the data cleaned up, i put almost no effort into that out of the box. i cut and paste what was in the pdfs cory links to in the side menu. i fixed some spelling mistakes but not even all of those. i was more interested in designing a system that would be super easy to update and intuitive to use. i feel it would be inefficient for me to try to comb the data if cory is gonna drop some of his data in there. we aren't going to get better info than that. but its fine if he doesn't, we have pretty much what we need and i can give access to a few different members of the community to keep up on the updates and fine grained details.
for the pricing and other variable items i was thinking about setting up a spreadsheet that captures ranges for items, so over time as data accumulates we get a feel for what is a good deal and what isn't. but that kinda starts to sound like work and i'm here to have fun :-)
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 25, 2011 19:39:24 GMT -5
Is there a reason the coordinates in the game don't align with standard x,y axis? That is: Why is the further 'down' you go become more positive? Shouldn't 'down' become a negative Y coordinate? Just curious. I notice the things made here use normal x,y labeling, but the game doesn't, so we just have to invert the +/- of the y axis to get where it is. Visually it's perfect though. Freeking amazing work Just curious like I said. I'm okay with it, but it took me a while to get used to it. good catch! i forgot to mention that. the part that took the most time was figuring out a way to get google charts to invert the y axis. it should be simple! but apparently there is no way to do it, so i negated all the y values to get it to come out right. that's why i labelled it -Y. it bugs me tho when a feature like that would be easy to build and would be so useful but gets overlooked |
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Post by aielman on Jun 25, 2011 23:14:54 GMT -5
Interesting ships:
Wave Runner - one of the most fearsome Torpedo boats. It has a good loadout with 16 torpedos, but has an awesome base sail:hull ratio at 28:15
Atmo Cutter - great engine to hull ratio at a 21 hull
Jango - great engine to hull ratio at 15 hull but has the same number of guns as the atmo
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Post by captain nemo on Jun 26, 2011 21:36:33 GMT -5
Now that's pretty awesome !!!
Thanks
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 27, 2011 11:51:34 GMT -5
good metrics. would you say hull is the best measure of a ship's mass? i am still learning about the physics of the game. when you compare hull + armor the atmo cutter's ratio gets even better. its cargo hold isn't even that shabby and with some upgrades would be the most badass trading vessel in the galaxy. buy one today, these prices won't last forever! do some factions tend to make certain kinds of ships more than others? thulun has everyone beat on pure volume but on a busy star trader day other factions are just as good. |
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 13:06:43 GMT -5
Speed and Agility is actually these two calculations (which if you could add these to the charts I would LOVE it as it better represents the values)
speed = sails/hull
agility = engines/hull
1.0 >= X is low
1.0 < X < 2.0 is medium
2.0 <= X is high
So, while hull+armor is a great stat to look at damage soak, straight hull is a better metric to use when looking at the manueverability of the craft.
Heres a great chart (nvm cant save state? - see below to recreate) that shows the ability to close and fire (ie engine killing machines) As you can tell there are 3 really good trend lines on the Quick ships (the bottom lines) the medium ships (up the middle) and Low ships (the top line) The more the color trends redder in its group the better it is in comparison to its neighbors at engine killing.
Engine killing:
Vertical Axis -> Hull
Horizontal Axis -> Engines
Color -> Guns
Circle size -> Cargo (really this can be anything, I just like to hold what I take, armor to defend against ramming would probably be useful as well)
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 13:22:17 GMT -5
Hey, would be possible to put something in there to run stats with max ups? Ie, max cargo, max engines, max guns?
specifically max engines/sails would rock because you would start to see some majorly different speed calculations when you factor in the fact that its based off the ratios and not straight.
Cory - How does armor vs hull work? Is there some ratio at play here or is it really just +armor = additional damage soak?
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 14:52:13 GMT -5
poker, is there anywhere we could go to add information for you? I know its missing alot of the new ships as well as several planets, and if we had someplace easy to goto to add information maybe we could try to keep these things updated as Cory updates the game.
Even if it was a google doc spreadsheet that you manually added access to, I think it would be helpful.
Missing Ship, Hull,Armor,Engines,Sails,Crew,Cargo,Guns,Torpedos,S,A
Jump Frigate,18,7,28,18,40,60,14,12,Slow,Medium
Blockade Runner,16,6,17,31,44,30,18,9,Medium, Medium
Templar Smuggler,12,5,13,14,35,40,18,6,Medium,Medium
Templar Explorer,8,4,13,16,21,56,10,2,Fast,Medium
Infiltrator Class,22,11,24,44,55,60,38,4,Fast,Medium
Blade Class,13,6,27,27,48,52,24,10,Fast,Quick
Templar Raider,7,3,14,14,20,52,8,4,Fast,Quick
Templar Merchant,10,4,10,14,22,52,15,5,Medium,Low
Pirate Battlecruiser,20,10,31,31,70,70,10,20,Medium,Medium
Luck Runner,7,3,14,14,22,42,8,2,Fast,Quick
Pirate Raptor,14,7,17,28,60,60,26,8,Fast,Medium
Line Jammer,18,5,36,19,45,45,16,7,Medium,Quick
Cyber Jammer,18,8,36,28,75,75,25,12,Medium,Quick
Fenrir Dart,18,6,19,38,47,60,28,9,Fast,Medium
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 27, 2011 15:06:08 GMT -5
Speed and Agility is actually these two calculations (which if you could add these to the charts I would LOVE it as it better represents the values) speed = sails/hull agility = engines/hull 1.0 >= X is low 1.0 < X < 2.0 is medium 2.0 <= X is high very useful info! i noticed that this number correlates very poorly with the speed and agility values in the game. why do you think that is? this makes sense mathematically but maybe there is an x-factor nice work! bit.ly/star_traders_rpg_engine_killersso is it generally optimal to get close to an opponent and take out their engines directly? i don't seem to have much luck with that, but then again i tend to focus on trade more than battle sadly it doesn't save state. its not that hard to generate a new state in the spreadsheet and save it. actually, i've been over-thinking the linking. here is a direct link to the read only original spreadsheets: bit.ly/star_traders_rpg_chartsi often have a hard time seeing the obvious |
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 15:14:59 GMT -5
With a good pilot and ship agility, yah, taking out their engines is generally considered to be one of the best ways to incapacitate a ship without destroying it. Granted, if you have high warrior and you can board you can get the ship with alot less damage so its kinda a trade off.
I am not really for sure what you mean with the number relating poorly? I have only found 1 ship that it doesn't fit, and I generally think its because of a bug and not the math/formula.
edit:
ok I found a few ships off by one, Cory might be able to shed a light as to why, I am guessing the xls is incorrect but not for sure.
Ship: type, GameIs, Calculated
Cruiser: Agility,Med,Low
Light Runner: Agility,Med,Low
Pirate Hawk: Agility,Quick,Med (Fairly sure this one has been fixed in game to be Med)
Wave Runner: Speed, Fast,Med
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Post by pokerjunky on Jun 27, 2011 15:24:51 GMT -5
With a good pilot and ship agility, yah, taking out their engines is generally considered to be one of the best ways to incapacitate a ship without destroying it. Granted, if you have high warrior and you can board you can get the ship with alot less damage so its kinda a trade off. I am not really for sure what you mean with the number relating poorly? I have only found 1 ship that it doesn't fit, and I generally think its because of a bug and not the math/formula. i think i see what happened. the formula we've been discussing is sails/hull and engines/hull, but the number in the game looks like hull/sails and hull/engines (*2 and rounded, it looks like). does that sound right? if so i'll go flip them |
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 15:26:34 GMT -5
With a good pilot and ship agility, yah, taking out their engines is generally considered to be one of the best ways to incapacitate a ship without destroying it. Granted, if you have high warrior and you can board you can get the ship with alot less damage so its kinda a trade off. I am not really for sure what you mean with the number relating poorly? I have only found 1 ship that it doesn't fit, and I generally think its because of a bug and not the math/formula. i think i see what happened. the formula we've been discussing is sails/hull and engines/hull, but the number in the game looks like hull/sails and hull/engines (*2 and rounded, it looks like). does that sound right? if so i'll go flip them YES thank you, that has been driving me up the wall that they were backwards :-) |
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Post by aielman on Jun 27, 2011 15:34:01 GMT -5
oooo love the new agility calc
Check out
Vert: Hull
Hor: Engines/Hull
Color: Old Agility
Thats a pretty cool freaking chart
Also, if you look at the same for Speed, I think your Sails/Hulls is inverted
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I died in a shuttle though going to move one from one drydock to another though... I was sad.
