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Post by anrdaemon on May 5, 2015 17:19:41 GMT -5
Currently, having building queue serves no purpose.
If you have excess CP after completion of a building project, they will go into idle pool (means, converted into useless money) regardless of the building queue state.
If you add up CP from exploration over that, it will be completely lost without a trace.
Solution could be long- or short-termed.
Short-termed solution: All excess CP after completion of current "project under construction" is applied to the first next (and only first) "queued project". Any overflow CP after that will go into idle pool. Regardless of the origin of CP.
Long-termed solution: CP is applied all the way down queue, until either available CP pool or queue capacity to receive CP is exhausted. The rest is naturally spilled into idle pool.
Regardless of the path or results of overflow calculation, one planet will not commission more than one project per turn, ever.
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on May 5, 2015 18:39:38 GMT -5
Money is never useless in ST4X
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Post by anrdaemon on May 5, 2015 18:44:32 GMT -5
You can buy out the missing CP with money? No? Then it is a waste to convert CP to money in first place.
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Post by Brutus Aurelius on May 5, 2015 19:03:31 GMT -5
You can buy out the missing CP with money? No? Then it is a waste to convert CP to money in first place. No, but you can Subsidize, which reduces the amount of time for Upgrades or Treaties for more Credits. That same money will come in handy when it comes time to pay the bills, or deal with a Spy War or Solar War. |
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Post by fallen on May 5, 2015 19:03:40 GMT -5
Currently, having building queue serves no purpose. This makes no sense to me. The build queue in fact serves a lot of purpose  I like Brutus Aurelius's answer too. |
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Post by En1gma on May 5, 2015 19:20:20 GMT -5
Does the left over CP from a project get turned into money, or is it wasted? I've always wondered about this part of building projects... If it's not used, and just disappears, then it would be smart to aim for CP in multiples of 5, so that as little gets wasted as possible.
The build queue is crazy useful mid to late game, when you have well over a dozen systems and plenty of credits flowing in. Pick two or three projects at a time, then just let them keep building while you take care of combat, system building, etc... Early game I don't have the credits, so I don't use the build queue much at all, so I see where you would find it useless, but it is a great timesaver later on.
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Post by anrdaemon on May 5, 2015 19:38:08 GMT -5
They are turned to money (only CP generated by colony, you can confirm it by searching for "idle CP" in empire summary texts). CP from exploration seems to be lost. Currently, having building queue serves no purpose. This makes no sense to me. The build queue in fact serves a lot of purpose Name me some purposes? I don't see why should I stuff the queue, wile I can just order upgrades one by one and no difference will be observed, CP will be wasted just the same if I queue 3-5 projects in a line, or if I wait for one to complete before ordering another. Subsidy is a joke. Pay tenfold to get 30% off the tip - sounds much like a typical political endeavor. "We'll start this project and you do whatever you want with it, we don't care. We already got your votes." |
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Post by Cory Trese on May 5, 2015 23:01:11 GMT -5
The build queue is specifically intended, designed and balanced to NOT give you any in-game advantage over placing upgrades one at time. It seems to be working in that regard. It is specifically designed to provide a convenience feature, to simplify the management of placing upgrades and to allow build sequences to be executed with minimum player input, aside from initial planning. Some recent updates to the Turn Log have been aimed at making that even more effective -- and I think players are reaping the rewards of that work. "Name me some purpose" <--- Convenience of play. For players who appreciate it, it is the reward itself. I believe that anrdaemon elegantly states the rule in the first post: "No one planet will commission more than one project per turn." Credit generation from CP is considered a project. CP that remain after the execution of a Colony's CP plan are discarded. There are many good reasons for these rules -- and with some discussion I suspect we could probably come up with more that I haven't even considered or researched yet. Great posts, thanks all! |
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Post by anrdaemon on May 6, 2015 9:27:03 GMT -5
In other words, the only way to use build queue without wasting CP is to constantly micromanage it, shifting orders up and down, spending 3-5 times more time per each turn?
I got your intentions right?
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Post by Cory Trese on May 6, 2015 9:40:30 GMT -5
In other words, the only way to use build queue without wasting CP is to constantly micromanage it, shifting orders up and down, spending 3-5 times more time per each turn? I got your intentions right? Oh absolutely not. I'm completely confused as to how you would read THAT from the post I made. |
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Post by anrdaemon on May 6, 2015 10:48:22 GMT -5
Because I don't see other ways to save CP from being devalued.
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Post by Cory Trese on May 6, 2015 11:12:22 GMT -5
Because I don't see other ways to save CP from being devalued. Oh, sorry, it wasn't clear what you were trying to say. You're talking about the queue ordering and sequencing issue. We definitely talked about it a lot during the alpha, and with the help of that team settled on a solid equation. The CP costs, CP generation values and the spending event schedule, are configured and smoothed so that the absolute advantage, even if an AI were playing perfectly, is right around 1% through the first 1600 turns. However, it is a turn based and single player game. If a player wanted to, I suppose, spend the additional time per turn for a 1% advantage ... I dunno. Spending that same time micro-managing combat or ship designs would yield, I suspect (harder to quantify with Excel) a much higher return on investment. |
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Post by fallen on May 6, 2015 11:13:52 GMT -5
anrdaemon - If you move a Hab Unit that is 8/10 done into second position ... when you move it back up, it is still 8/10.
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Post by anrdaemon on May 6, 2015 12:48:07 GMT -5
Colony generating 4CP.
Currently manufactured item has 1 CP left.
The next item I plan to construct - Colony Hub (the most CP/$ efficient upgrade, except spice festival, so far) - requires 10 CP and $100 to build.
I can place it in queue for $100, or subsidize it at a rate of $33 per CP.
3 CP leftover generate $30 revenue.
I can't get back even one CP of the 3 wasted for the money they generated.
P.S.
Re: Excel
There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics. (Attributed to Benjamin Disraeli, but never actually proved to be his.)
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Post by anrdaemon on May 6, 2015 12:59:38 GMT -5
P.P.S.
CP from exploration:
Start tutorial. Colonize one planet with Cadar Syndicate.
Subsidize 1 Hab Unit. Pass the turn.
Explore anomaly that generates 10CP. Pass turn.
CP are nowhere to be found. $1044 - $1 maintenance = $1043.
3 CP overflow and 10 CP from exploration just… poof…
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