Ep 2: To re-spec or not to re-spec. That is the question...

[contributor]

Thanks matrim for the good post on stealth. I recently started a new group with Tamilin, Vraes, Fyona and KJ. It's going to be a high armor/HP group, but we're still in E1 messing with Ratkin. At the moment I like leading with Vraes. He's solid right now and there's no way he could be killed on the first turn. Fyona is behind him (love that we can now rearrange parties). The other advantage of not leading with stealth is that the mobs all move up on their first turn, leaving me more AP to attack with. It sounds though like I'm going to have to transition to leading with Tamilin later, but she really scares me.

Edit: Forgot to mention, this is an ironman nightmare team.

[En1gma]

I've toyed with the idea of Stealth Lead Kincaid, and it is effective if you run his Curses. You only need a few points in his Stealth Skill to make it viable, and much of the + Stealth gear in the game comes stock with + Dodge anyway, so it isn't too much of a chore to make it work.

I would use him as Stealth Lead if I went heavy on Darting Steel, as I would want him to spread the curse around as much as possible to make it easier for say Fyona to come in with heavy melee talents that need to connect (cough Consecrated Defense, cough). It also would pair well with high level Ash, Strickening, or any other way you have to boost damages. It's easy to overlook the fact that point for point, Darting Steel has the most effective Dodge/Parry curse effect in the game, so the argument that he could be used as the primary D/P curser is very valid.

As to dagger's questions, so long as you lead with a stealth character, and throw every third point into Stealth while giving them + Stealth Gear priority, you shouldn't have any issues =)

[achilles73]

Jan 4, 2017 14:11:18 GMT -5 En1gma said:

I've toyed with the idea of Stealth Lead Kincaid, and it is effective if you run his Curses. You only need a few points in his Stealth Skill to make it viable, and much of the + Stealth gear in the game comes stock with + Dodge anyway, so it isn't too much of a chore to make it work.

I would use him as Stealth Lead if I went heavy on Darting Steel, as I would want him to spread the curse around as much as possible to make it easier for say Fyona to come in with heavy melee talents that need to connect (cough Consecrated Defense, cough). It also would pair well with high level Ash, Strickening, or any other way you have to boost damages. It's easy to overlook the fact that point for point, Darting Steel has the most effective Dodge/Parry curse effect in the game, so the argument that he could be used as the primary D/P curser is very valid.

As to the OP, so long as you lead with a stealth character, and throw every third point into Stealth while giving them + Stealth Gear priority, you shouldn't have any issues =)

Is there enough gear out there to ensure he maintains 1:1 stealth:level ratio? I don't see it at least until you get crafting implemented.

And seriously: Selen is such an obvious and easy choice. Why go with someone else? She's "easy" and "performs" marvelously!

[En1gma]

Kincaid doesn't need 1:1 Stealth-- he's the fighter and can survive losing a stealth round. So long as you give him points in it and gear to keep him going, you'll win enough rounds. I don't think it's possible to win every single stealth round, so it falls on you to ensure you can survive it when it happens

Don't overlook Tamilin... I use Selen for 95% of my parties, but when I use Tamilin it is always worth it, as she is capable of insane amounts of damage. Using Selen means you have a more survivable character, there is no doubt there, but using her gives up the sheer numbers of damage that Tamilin can put out.

[achilles73]

Jan 4, 2017 14:25:21 GMT -5 En1gma said:

Kincaid doesn't need 1:1 Stealth-- he's the fighter and can survive losing a stealth round. So long as you give him points in it and gear to keep him going, you'll win enough rounds. I don't think it's possible to win every single stealth round, so it falls on you to ensure you can survive it when it happens

Don't overlook Tamilin... I use Selen for 95% of my parties, but when I use Tamilin it is always worth it, as she is capable of insane amounts of damage. Using Selen means you have a more survivable character, there is no doubt there, but using her gives up the sheer numbers of damage that Tamilin can put out.

Selen's damage is not peanuts either though. At Pinning Shot 8, it's frankly stupendous. And her versatility is out of this world.

[En1gma]

Still doesn't beat Ranged Onslaught with max Deadly Intuition

You haven't seen true damage until you've played Tamilin. I fully agree that Selen is the more versatile, and the hardier, but Tam will always beat her for damage, in every instance.

[phaze]

I am giving tamilin a spin to replace Selen and enjoying it greatly. I give a nod to Selen for her better HP but think the survivability of each is reasonable.

I have played Selen exclusively for a long time, and while QsD gives her great defense but only if you level it. My last playthrough I realized I never use her QsD as she is ranged PS. Given that, I was losing out on tamilin's superior crit chance and independence of all accuracy gear. Plus, ToS gets block area for a cheap 6 sp compared to PS 13.

I believe my current tamilin actually has superior defense to how I played Selen. Tamilin gets dodge from her stealth talent, better dodge factor, an extra 4 die at dex 16, and melee defense with raising thrown skill.

Given a ToS of 5, she can readily pursue a second attack talent.

[fallen]

Jan 4, 2017 22:25:50 GMT -5 phaze said:

I am giving tamilin a spin to replace Selen and enjoying it greatly. I give a nod to Selen for her better HP but think the survivability of each is reasonable.

I have played Selen exclusively for a long time, and while QsD gives her great defense but only if you level it. My last playthrough I realized I never use her QsD as she is ranged PS. Given that, I was losing out on tamilin's superior crit chance and independence of all accuracy gear. Plus, ToS gets block area for a cheap 6 sp compared to PS 13.

I believe my current tamilin actually has superior defense to how I played Selen. Tamilin gets dodge from her stealth talent, better dodge factor, an extra 4 die at dex 16, and melee defense with raising thrown skill.

Given a ToS of 5, she can readily pursue a second attack talent.

Great to hear! This lines up with my experiences with Tami on higher difficulties as well.

One thing, always remember to upgrade her throwing dagger even if you don't use them, as she gets Parry from them.

[matrim]

My preference is Tamilin as well. I love her synergy with Fyona and strickening. ToS is now my favourite all purpose curse (oh but CA is so good too, darn can't decide!). Gutting AP, Dodge, and res while doing awesome area damage and being able to spam it for 1 AP. That move is the full meal deal.
That said I believe that of all the class choices the sneak slot is the most balanced. Selen brings tons of uniqueness too and the only real reason I choose Tamilin over her is because I can never let my Fyona go.

[wascalwywabbit]

The only thing Selen is missing is AoE melee... Come on new SaS, I wanna see your play style...

[dagger]

So I cleared the Underforge, met with the Druid, and spoke to the Knight in Brunehorn. I've now gone as far as I can (I think) along the Koda storyline without going into the City of the Dead. My question is can I now go an do the Braeys side of things and then make my decision on who to support after that? If I enter the City now will it basically take out all the Braeys stuff? I'd like to head north and get both sides of the story but I read somewhere you could get "locked in" to completing the whole north storyline and I think I want to support Koda because something somewhere said something about them being spear experts and I've got Vraes with spears.

Anyway, any insight would be appreciated....thank you!

[contributor]

You can still go do the Braeys side. I think what they meant about being locked in, is that once you start the Braeys side you can't get out of it till it's finished. It doesn't lock you into going with them though. You just won't be able to go back to Koda until most everything in the north is finished. I would definitely recommend doing Braeys before COD for the experience you'll gain. It's a fun storyline too. Aren't you wondering about what happened to Valent?

[dagger]

Who's Valent? lol I took the south fork out of Riven Field and know nothing about what's going on in the Braeys story. I do remember that a Koda son went to Braeys but I haven't heard anything more than that he went. Can I go to Granthorn yet or am I better off going north first?

[contributor]

I would go to Granthorn first. Bring some cash for the smith there.

[wascalwywabbit]

Jan 7, 2017 23:19:24 GMT -5 dagger said:

Who's Valent? lol I took the south fork out of Riven Field and know nothing about what's going on in the Braeys story. I do remember that a Koda son went to Braeys but I haven't heard anything more than that he went. Can I go to Granthorn yet or am I better off going north first?

Someone to rescue, he's the Koda son. I'd've thrown him back in his cell to think about his baditude (bad attitude) after being rescued, if I were given the option. I'd of let him out again after he apologized for being a bit touchy and dickish... I wonder about killing all the captures next time, but leaving him to rot... I have a hard time not choosing the 'hero's' path though. Children do need their manners though! 😈